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U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

timescolonist.com

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Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#61
post #16
post #2

The scales of money at play always seem so strange. Oh a few hundred million for ocean sensors, or about what a few OpenAI / Cursor employees or a few hundred FAANG employees could personally fund if they desired to do so.

[flagged]

actually - they're not

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#62
post #2

The scales of money at play always seem so strange. Oh a few hundred million for ocean sensors, or about what a few OpenAI / Cursor employees or a few hundred FAANG employees could personally fund if they desired to do so.

Its not even about saving money. If they just wanted to save money they'd just stop paying attention to the data coming in, retask/lay off the people working on it, and let the buoys stay out there. A dumb idea to me, but at least that's consistent. Let other organizations decide to manage the buoys. While I'd prefer for the government to do it, it could be possible to have other groups fund such things. It would be…

"Don't Look Up" was a documentary.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#63

As a physical oceanographer, the destruction of these observing systems is horrific. It is hard to stress enough how intentionally OMB is trying to disassemble American science. The new (proposed) OMB guidelines prohibit international collaboration without pre approval for example. They also codify a political grant approval process. https://arstechnica.com/science/2026/05/the-office-of-manage... Additionally, OMB is…

OMB = “Office of Management and Budget”. It’s a White House office run by Russell Vought, highly ideological maga institutionalist.

(and one of the authors of Project 2025)

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#64
Let me guess, they want it privatized?

IIRC, Project 2025 argued that private companies provided more accurate weather forecasts, and thus one can just dismantle gov. agencies like NOAA and the market for such services will take care of itself.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#65
Look at all of the headlines coming out of the department of energy:

https://www.energy.gov/newsroom

Lots of them related to coal and LNG.

Most prominently: https://www.energy.gov/articles/energy-department-invest-350...

The policy of the federal government is anti renewable energy and pro coal, pro oil.

Oil executives are profiting from the situation with Iran. These guys don't want us to have cheap renewable energy. They want us to keep paying their tolls and they don't want anyone to have access to evidence that could continue exposing the damage they've done to the environment.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#66
post #7
post #4

Read the article, but I'm still not seeing why the U.S. is pulling these sensors. Anyone have any insight?

Science is evil and must be destroyed at all costs.

Applying even an ounce of argumentative empathy will make you more convincing and psychologically healthier.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#68

As a physical oceanographer, the destruction of these observing systems is horrific. It is hard to stress enough how intentionally OMB is trying to disassemble American science. The new (proposed) OMB guidelines prohibit international collaboration without pre approval for example. They also codify a political grant approval process. https://arstechnica.com/science/2026/05/the-office-of-manage... Additionally, OMB is…

The other thing they've done is make it possible to cancel any grant at any time if it goes against the politics of the current executive administration.

Science has flourished in the US precisely because it could proceed without whimsical political picking and choosing, entire areas of science have flourished that would never have happened otherwise.

That's not to say that politics is completely out of science, Congress has done things like ban any research money for gun safety, for example. But that had to make it through Congress, a vote across party lines, instead of just being the political whim of some bureaucrat that can cancel whatever they want whenever they want.

For every issue you read about here on HN, there are about 10 other policy changes designed to destroy the US's scientific infrastructure. It doesn't get much attention because of all the other chaos going on, and scientists tend to be pretty quiet and try to stay apolitical, but it is truly a full-on crisis in the scientific research community right now. You won't see immediate effects, but in 10-20 years when China zooms ahead of the US on all research fronts and the US is left out of key technology and science directions, we will feel it then.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#69
post #2

The scales of money at play always seem so strange. Oh a few hundred million for ocean sensors, or about what a few OpenAI / Cursor employees or a few hundred FAANG employees could personally fund if they desired to do so.

It’s nothing to do with money, that’s always the libertarian excuse, and HN laps it up far more than the rest of the word.

Have to sternly disagree: at least on the conservative side, it is thoroughly lapped up. Right wingers the world over constantly vote to fuck themselves and the rest of us over with this never ending whingeing about debt, spending, pork, what have you. On this particular issue it's even less surprising since the only thing perhaps a right winger wants to hear less about than government spending is climate change.

The entire debt ceiling bullshit is political theatre and always has been. We didn't even have a debt ceiling for the majority of our existence as a nation, and since it's creation by right wingers, it has been used as a bludgeon by right wingers to kneecap anything that stood to benefit the civil good of our country. Austerity politics have been deployed here and elsewhere to great effect to destroy social programs, demonize those who need them, and reallocate trillions of dollars to the private sector to provide the same services the public sector did, but worse, and while enriching greedy assholes the entire way. And the whole way it has been done by an enthusiastic and approving portion of the public who can be persuaded to feel outrage that seventy cents of their yearly taxes are going to some program in some far off part of the country they'll never see.

Meanwhile the actual national debt soars, and under who? Yep, fucking right wingers again. And every time we want to do something science and evidence backed like give the homeless somewhere to live, we're met with a chorus of WHO'S GONNA PAY FOR IT, but every goddamn time there's another country full of brown kids to blow the fuck off the face of the Earth, we always, always have money for that.

It's disgusting and I hate it here.

Re: U.S. pulling ocean sensors a 'shock' for Canadian research as El Niño nears

#70

As a physical oceanographer, the destruction of these observing systems is horrific. It is hard to stress enough how intentionally OMB is trying to disassemble American science. The new (proposed) OMB guidelines prohibit international collaboration without pre approval for example. They also codify a political grant approval process. https://arstechnica.com/science/2026/05/the-office-of-manage... Additionally, OMB is…

OMB = “Office of Management and Budget”. It’s a White House office run by Russell Vought, highly ideological maga institutionalist.

Also famous for being a principal architect and author of Project 2025, which explicitly calls for impoundment as a mechanism for expanding presidential authority to control the Federal budget for political purposes.
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