[flagged]
Man this thread is like catnip for racists.
They just can’t help themselves
What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
61–70 of 201 posts
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe the fertility rate has to go below zero to bounce back... Japan's rate is like 1.14 yet [1]. Hopefully Korea has figure out something more actionable [1] https://english.kyodonews.net/articles/-/77220
What's fertility rate below zero? Women not only have zero babies, they also sometimes kill babies of others?
A rate below 0.99… so less than 1 kid per 2 adults
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#63You know, many eastern countries apparently intuitively think in cycles. The west tends to think linearly: "We're trending upwards, argh argh overpopulation, famine, death. We're trending downwards, argh argh population collapse, famine, death".
Same with the perception of time. My country sees time as a line. I once had an interesting training where the instructor pointed this out. She went on to say that seeing time as a circle or a point is also an option. It wasn't until I hit the second half of life that I got a glimpse of what that looks like, personally.
Perhaps subconsciously, Japan envisions that the birth rate will go up again sometime in the future and they will have preserved their identity and culture from which to build again.
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#64I am really shocked at the tone of so many of the comments here. Did HN become a breeding ground for xenophobia at some point? Has it always been that and is it just way more mask off now?
Unbridled immigration doesn’t work, and that’s become pretty clear.
You need limits, and integration, assimilation would be even better.
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
Japan's population is dropping like a stone. Since I first arrived here some years ago the population has gone down by several millions. Countries which have more immigration (like my native one, also with a low birth rate) manage to keep up the population size, and, equally important, manage to keep the median age somewhat lower (the median age in Japan is now above 50). If immigration is not a solution, then I assu…
The main problem is that solutions would be very expensive and, unfortunately, politicians don't get (re-)elected to solve problems that manifest over the span of decades.
What solutions though?
From my tangential experience (brother and wife live in Tokyo), there are a ton of programs that are extremely desirable from the US birthrate/childcare perspective already.
Base level of 8 weeks Maternity leave , with 6 weeks ahead of birth as well. And government pays a lump sum to help cover hospital costs per birth.
The community support and available activities.
Seesh the only things that seem negative are the Japanese type of xenophobic culture (my family is white, so their kids are mixed), and the small living space which leaves little room for privacy in like any point of their day.
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
> no country has reversed its birth rate problem. America has, it reversed below subsistence rate birth rates. More importantly despite some years of negative population growth the net long term trend is slow population growth. So despite both issues the long term trend is slow net population growth. Thus significantly below subsistence birth rates where flipped from a massive issue to a non issue.
So it hasn’t?
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Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#67Earlier quoted context omitted.
Japan's population is dropping like a stone. Since I first arrived here some years ago the population has gone down by several millions. Countries which have more immigration (like my native one, also with a low birth rate) manage to keep up the population size, and, equally important, manage to keep the median age somewhat lower (the median age in Japan is now above 50). If immigration is not a solution, then I assu…
The main problem is that solutions would be very expensive and, unfortunately, politicians don't get (re-)elected to solve problems that manifest over the span of decades.
I don't think that's correct. Saying that "solutions would be very expensive" implies that there are actual solutions in existence. I've seen a lot of suggestions, and many have been implemented, some do slow down the dropping birthrate problem (countries with good maternity leave systems and regulated working hours are doing way better than those without), but nowhere have I seen any true fix presented, with or without a label "will work, but will be too expensive".
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#68Earlier quoted context omitted.
> They need _someone_ (or something, if they can manage) to sustain the way of life they hold so dear. They don't though? Pensions will be cut. Retirements will be pushed back. Grandparents with dementia will be kept mostly-alive in their children's homes rather than getting proper care. There will be pain and suffering. But I don't see any of that pushing the country to breaking point. > And it's not something a cou…
Yeah not sure why you’re being downvoted. Work hard on making elderly care as easy as possible, automate automatable things. Importing people is just kicking the ageing population can down the road; these immigrant will grow old one day, and then what, import even more people?
People from other cultures tend to have more babies.
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
> no country has reversed its birth rate problem. America has, it reversed below subsistence rate birth rates. More importantly despite some years of negative population growth the net long term trend is slow population growth. So despite both issues the long term trend is slow net population growth. Thus significantly below subsistence birth rates where flipped from a massive issue to a non issue.
So it hasn’t?
US fertility rates first fell below replacement in 1972, falling to 1.8 by 1984, then rising back above replacement by 2007, then falling to 1.79 today. Despite being below replacement for 53 of the last 54 years, overall US population has never declined.
https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2023/highcharts/data/dubina-cha...
Re: What happens if Japan takes in zero immigrants?
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Also weird to admit that no country has reversed its birth rate problem, but still insist upon massive immigration being the solution. Because those "floodgates" for the most part have never existed and are just fear inducing rhetoric. Immigration has always been insignificant in terms of the whole population and therefore can not solve systemic problems alone.
How do you define insignificant? From 1950 to 2000 (50 years), the foreign born percentage of the UK doubled from 4% to 8%. In the 20 years after that, the percentage doubled again to 16%. In the five years since 2020, the percentage has increased another 4 points to ~20%. Not only is 13 million people not "insignificant" in my book, but clearly the trend is accelerating.
Look back a few hundred years and you'll find that the country you grew up in, in Europe, was constantly in that situation. People moved a lot back then too. And the countries are today.. the countries. It'll be fine.