If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret? • Hacker News Board

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#61

Post by Karrot_Kream » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:02 PM UTC

blanched wrote: post #47

atleastoptimal wrote: post #16

What is the advantage to not keeping them a secret? The populist movement against AI is growing rapidly, and is supported by bunk science which affirms people's pre-existing biases (like the idea that data centers suck up all the water in a community, or raise the ambient temperature by a single-double digit number of degrees F). AI is a genuine source of economic growth. I can understand wanting to curtail it, but i…

Why are they bunk science? I’m not an environmental expert, but the research papers and policies I’ve read don’t seem to be egregiously wrong. I’m asking genuinely, I’m open to changing my mind here.

Andy Massey writes about this stuff and is generally heavily disliked by the anti-data-center folks

* https://blog.andymasley.com/p/data-center-land-use-issues-ar...

* https://blog.andymasley.com/p/i-might-have-found-the-specifi...

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#62

Post by dieselgate » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:02 PM UTC

Sol- wrote: post #23

The less NIMBYs are involved or aware of any infrastructure project, the better. Is that even a question? They ruined enough opportunities and wealth in the last decades.

Yes, it is a question. Obviously a balance must be struck but where the line is drawn will depend. The point about "ruining wealth opportunities" will likely rub a lot of people the wrong way even on a place like YCombinator forum

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#63

Post by konmok » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:02 PM UTC

tekla wrote: post #26

konmok wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source on that water claim? Everything I've seen suggests the opposite.

You believe lies, 99% of data shows that data centers do not use appreciable amounts of water compared to almond farms, or gold courses, or bog standard lawns. https://tech.yahoo.com/science/articles/data-centers-less-wa...

That source says data centers use a lot of water. Less than all almond farms combined, sure, but it doesn't support the parent argument. It's also 3 years out of date, and not relevant to protests against all the data centers that have not yet been completed.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#64

Post by atleastoptimal » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:04 PM UTC

blanched wrote: post #47

atleastoptimal wrote: post #16

What is the advantage to not keeping them a secret? The populist movement against AI is growing rapidly, and is supported by bunk science which affirms people's pre-existing biases (like the idea that data centers suck up all the water in a community, or raise the ambient temperature by a single-double digit number of degrees F). AI is a genuine source of economic growth. I can understand wanting to curtail it, but i…

Why are they bunk science? I’m not an environmental expert, but the research papers and policies I’ve read don’t seem to be egregiously wrong. I’m asking genuinely, I’m open to changing my mind here.

Regarding water usage, in general data centers do not use more water than other types of heavy manufacturing

> The Georgia data center is only using ~2% of the county’s water. For comparison, a pharmaceutical manufacturing plant is using ~4% of the county’s water. A construction plant for Rivian cars is using about the same amount of water as Meta’s data center. The data center is functioning like any other normal industry in the county.

https://blog.andymasley.com/p/the-ai-water-issue-is-fake

Regarding data centers increasing ambient temp, the paper is simply measuring the surface temperature of the buildings, going against the claim that a data center, merely by its presence in a community, raises the ambient temperature by a few degrees or more

https://andymasley.com/writing/data-centers-heat-exhaust-is-...

I know both sources are from the same guy, but he cites many primary sources in his articles

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#65

Post by nonethewiser » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:04 PM UTC

Karrot_Kream wrote: post #42

atleastoptimal wrote: post #16

What is the advantage to not keeping them a secret? The populist movement against AI is growing rapidly, and is supported by bunk science which affirms people's pre-existing biases (like the idea that data centers suck up all the water in a community, or raise the ambient temperature by a single-double digit number of degrees F). AI is a genuine source of economic growth. I can understand wanting to curtail it, but i…

The US has deindustrialized and since the rise of NIMBY politics hasn't built new industry in any scale at all. The first freeway revolts happened in 1959. In the meantime, basically everyone has agreed that industrial growth and manufacturing as an abstract concept is Good (TM) but definitely not in my backyard. For a long time these kinds of things were just being built in neighborhoods where the residents were too…

This is an excellent analysis. The NIMBYism is pretty self-evident I think but I never thought about the disconnect automation may have caused between industry and advocates for industry.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#66

Post by saulpw » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:04 PM UTC

TulliusCicero wrote: post #20

metalliqaz wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

grocery stores? They are not comparable to data centers.

They aren't, and yet somehow you still find various groups who will fight them. Seattle is currently dealing with this for a new WinCo -- which is low-priced and employee-owned, making it particularly unobjectionable -- on a site that used to be a Sam's Club, so it's not even really a new development: https://www.seattletimes.com/business/real-estate/winco-plan... > North Seattle shoppers may need to wait even longer…

> The group, which tried and failed to disrupt plans for a WinCo coming to Renton last spring, has no website and is not registered with the state — leading to online speculation about who exactly is behind the group. But Karl Anuta, a Portland-based lawyer representing the coalition, said it’s made up of King County residents.

I'm reading this as "WinCo competitors who live in King County" instead of NIMBYs. It seems real shady and of course they'd want to make it seem like it was just a group of good ol' regular folks.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#67

Post by jtbigwoo » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:04 PM UTC

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #3

They're being built in as much secret as possible because everything is. Everything about land development is adversarial and the people who keep their mouths shut wind up taking fewer 4-7 figure screwings along the way than the honest people. It sucks that this how it is but even just the most casual familiarity with all the rules and processes makes it obvious why this is the way it is. You could find more than eno…

We, as a society, set up rules to allow the people to have a voice in decisions via various means including public meetings and various review procedures. There is a cost to these rules, but the alternative you're describing is a system where rules and laws don't matter and anyone with the ear of a few influential people can do whatever they want.

Just as an example, there's a data center in the early stages about 10 miles from my house. The land developer spent a year shopping for a city council that would skip the hearings required by state law and finally found a small exurb willing to break the law. Now the developer is racing to break ground before the lawsuits and restraining orders hit. This isn't the way that a logical society should work.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#68

Post by bediger4000 » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:04 PM UTC

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #3

They're being built in as much secret as possible because everything is. Everything about land development is adversarial and the people who keep their mouths shut wind up taking fewer 4-7 figure screwings along the way than the honest people. It sucks that this how it is but even just the most casual familiarity with all the rules and processes makes it obvious why this is the way it is. You could find more than eno…

But why shouldn't the possible neighbors of some unpleasant installation protest as much as allowed, and file lawsuits? Neighbors interests have value too, plus we in the USA have a constitutional right to free speech and petition for redress of grievances. The US also has an adversarial legal system. It pays off to file lawsuits if you can afford it.

My conclusion is that "NIMBY" isn't the problem, it's economic incentives and adversarial systems.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#69

Post by nodesocket » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:05 PM UTC

homeonthemtn wrote: post #18

nodesocket wrote: post #11

One reason is that politicians have vilified them for their own political means. Creating false narratives like they use huge amounts of water, when in fact the cooling is a closed loop system and use less water than a single busy restaurant. They are being used as yet another pawn piece to push inequity and climate change agendas. It’s been quite a successful strategy.

So successful that data centers are everywhere? I'm not following the logic here.

25 data center projects were canceled in 2025, up sharply from only 6 in 2024. 2026 numbers gonna be dramatically higher. 69 jurisdictions have enacted some form of moratorium, ban, or restriction on new data center construction. The friendly states such as Texas are just going to have all the data centers and thus reap all the financial and job benefits.

Re: If AI data centers are so great, why are they being built in secret?

#70

Post by blanched » Wed, Jun 03, 2026, 6:05 PM UTC

atleastoptimal wrote: post #64

blanched wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are they bunk science? I’m not an environmental expert, but the research papers and policies I’ve read don’t seem to be egregiously wrong. I’m asking genuinely, I’m open to changing my mind here.

Regarding water usage, in general data centers do not use more water than other types of heavy manufacturing > The Georgia data center is only using ~2% of the county’s water. For comparison, a pharmaceutical manufacturing plant is using ~4% of the county’s water. A construction plant for Rivian cars is using about the same amount of water as Meta’s data center. The data center is functioning like any other normal in…

Thanks for the reply and links, I’ll give it a read today.