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Leave Me Behind

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Re: Leave Me Behind

#61

Post by r2_pilot »

cryo32 wrote: post #46
josephg wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? I'm more motivated than ever to make stuff at the moment. I have a long list of projects I've always wanted to make, but I never had time. The barrier is so low now. For example, I want to make: - A mini OS on top of SeL4 - A UI framework based on SolidJS, for native apps, in rust. - My own photo manager (which can do backups & sync across all my devices). And a gallery to share photos with friends - A local…

Leisure projects for me at least are about the personal challenge and achievement. If the LLM does it, you achieved nothing.

I'm glad that you find achievement in the personal challenge. At home, I'm just getting things done. Small things, bigger things, and best of all I get to pet the dog more while it works in the background.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#62

Post by cryo32 »

joe_mamba wrote: post #43
lazystone wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we all been fooled by the sentence: "It's yet another automation, it's like horses were replaced by cars". It is not. Industrialization and automation is about manual labor. LLM/AI is about outsourcing thinking. And while I'll give two thumbs up for using ML(there is not 'I' in 'AI') as a technology for some tasks, outsourcing thinking is an evolutionary dead-end.

>LLM/AI is about outsourcing thinking. No it isn't. I still do the thinking on how to solve my problems, I only outsource the tedious part, which is typing the code and fixing the syntax errors till it all compiles and does what I want. If you also outsource thinking to it, that's your choice though. Or the company's choice. But ultimately the free market will deiced with products made using LLMs outcompete those mad…

It shouldn't be used for that either. The problem is our programming languages and tools are shit so we made another expensive tool to drive them.

I've said this elsewhere before but I single-handedly produced more actual tangible business value with Microsoft Access than anything else since. What was an hour's work is now a procurement process and thousands of lines of tedious configuration and boilerplate that involves pipelines and tens of services all coordinated and hosted by someone who has created a moat to extract money out of me.

All I want is a fucking report.

The LLM makes us blind to the gigantic fucking shit show we built.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#63

Post by cryo32 »

r2_pilot wrote: post #61
cryo32 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Leisure projects for me at least are about the personal challenge and achievement. If the LLM does it, you achieved nothing.

I'm glad that you find achievement in the personal challenge. At home, I'm just getting things done. Small things, bigger things, and best of all I get to pet the dog more while it works in the background.

Yeah so don't bother. I don't write code at home. What's the point? I go on holiday once a month!

Re: Leave Me Behind

#64

Post by righthand »

josephg wrote: post #57
lacedeconstruct wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

*Make anything "new"

Everything I want to make is new. I don't understand the objection. For example, the photo backup system I want to make will let me manage my ~400gb photo library. I want my library backed up on a couple devices, running linux and freebsd. I want my mac and iphone to have a local mirror of all the favorited photos, and when I'm at home, I want to be able to browse all photos from those devices by streaming them over…

Ente photos is one thing and there are others.

You can accomplish most of that by installing Syncthing.

But the objection is that you’re not really building anything new even if you think it’s a new idea. By your definition you’re building for yourself and not sharing…so what good are your little projects. Reading your original list it just seems like you want to build and run software without having to do any research, even if a solution already exists.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#65

Post by cryo32 »

josephg wrote: post #57
lacedeconstruct wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

*Make anything "new"

Everything I want to make is new. I don't understand the objection. For example, the photo backup system I want to make will let me manage my ~400gb photo library. I want my library backed up on a couple devices, running linux and freebsd. I want my mac and iphone to have a local mirror of all the favorited photos, and when I'm at home, I want to be able to browse all photos from those devices by streaming them over…

What's your time and life worth? You pay Apple to deal with it (which I do) and get to live a peaceful life and go out and take photos and have experiences. Or do you spend weeks implementing your own solution with Claude. The latter is considerably higher cost in time and money.

AI is seen as a way out of drudgery but you're just trading one problem for another.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#66

Post by illithid0 »

baddash wrote: post #60
illithid0 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is some anecdata, but I'll share it nonetheless as I have a pretty wide network of software and security engineer friends from which I've heard the following. Almost no one I know wants agent usage to be a zero-sum activity. There are a few oddballs who obviously only got into software for the money, so any means to that end is acceptable. That does not stop those with say-so over things like employment (and, if…

That's good to know, because all I really go off of is what I see posted online which is most likely skewed towards the polarizing takes (been unemployed for a while). Sounds like some positive news though, and I hope that these tools can help empower people to the point where they don't feel shackled by their jobs by doing something like lowering the barrier and manpower needed to succeed at entrepreneurship. That s…

I'm in a position right now where I'm trying to decide if staying in my own field of information security is worth it to me. I have an entire project plan built out for using local models to do some crazy augmentation of my own skill set, e.g. malware development pipelines and vulnerability research.

My biggest problem as an independent contractor is marketing and notoriety. Security has been a race to the bottom for over a decade now, but it's gotten exponentially worse. LLMs can't just do my job, but there are enough people with checkbooks who believe that it can and enough companies out there with an incentive to confirm that belief that it's getting harder for me to find work organically.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#67

Post by cryo32 »

gordian-mind wrote: post #40

I don't think AI changed anything at all to the possibility of communicating between humans. This is a job that you've always been able to do alone in your cave.

It has. Some utter morons seem to run everything they receive and send through it at work.

I have a spreadsheet now of people I can't be fucked with.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#68

Post by ganSo »

h_i_vitale wrote: post #3

Not gonna pretend that this is anything other than the author's personal gripe with this whole thing, but this is really just the sunk cost fallacy with extra steps. Even by trying to reassure (the reader? Himself?) that LLMs are just a tool for humans, he asserts in the final paragraph that software is no longer made by humans. Something something linotype operators.

What's your take on it?

Re: Leave Me Behind

#69

Post by JSR_FDED »

jvanderbot wrote: post #18

Its classic HN to dismiss the emotional cost of change as sunk cost stages of grief. A person is allowed to love their work and miss deep understanding, and allowed to be nostalgic for a preferred way of working. It's human and everything they have shared in this post is unequivocally true about software dev and moving into a career, arguably even before LLMs took over. What I mean is that the thrilling buddy system…

> Its just inevitable to fall out of love of the craft

This is not some kind of universal truth. I can see how being stuck in an unfulfilling job could lead you to say this. But for the last 20+ years I love the craft of writing efficient, dependable, understandable code more with every new insight from every hard-won experience.

Re: Leave Me Behind

#70

Post by [deleted] »

rrgok wrote: post #47
kibwen wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> take human intelligence to another pinnacle I see no indication that current human intelligence is at anything close to a historical pinnacle. Human knowledge, yes, but intelligence? No. Collectively, we're dumb and trending dumber, and the tendency towards lazy thoughtlessness which AI engenders will accelerate that trend.

What do you mean by intelligence? And by your definition of it, can intelligence be improved intentionally or it happens as it happens like for evolution? If it happens by intention then why we have not pushed it at its maximium yet?

[deleted]
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