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Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

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Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#61

Post by breppp »

ktallett wrote: post #6
breppp wrote: post #5

[flagged]

You mean other than Berlin, Malmö, Paris, London, Munich, and many others. Europe doesn't have so many huge companies but that's not a bad thing. We do have a lot of companies doing key work that may benefit society as a whole.

While there are outliers, most of the European economy is Spain rather than Sweden

The European economy is still largely the same as pre-WW2, heavy machineries, cars, chemicals and these are becoming less relevant with Chinese competition. However, the move to tech never materialized like in the US, so no surprise when soccer becomes more important than anything else, it's the only long term viable export in bleak places like Spain

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#62

Post by swiftcoder »

embedding-shape wrote: post #60
swiftcoder wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Movistar, masmovil, and orange. From what I can tell they all tend to implement slightly different overlapping blocks. I wouldn't be nearly as annoyed if the blocking actually worked - my neighbour happily watches pirate futbol streams over the internal while my dev tools get blocked

Huh, where is the court order about the Fastly stuff? Also funny that the only major one you seem to be missing is Vodafone, which is the ISP I have, and Fastly never been blocked here, although Vodafone is more than eager to add things to their block-list. > while my dev tools get blocked What dev tools are you talking about here, that depends on remote Cloudflare IPs? Maybe I got used to the overall crap internet s…

> What dev tools are you talking about here, that depends on remote Cloudflare IPs?

It's never just been Cloudflare. There's even a blogpost from Vercel[1] about it when they had their exit nodes banned during the biggest outage last year:

> This issue isn’t isolated to Vercel. Cloudflare, GitHub Pages, and BunnyCDN are also affected.

[1] https://vercel.com/blog/update-on-spain-and-laliga-blocks-of...

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#63

Post by embedding-shape »

swiftcoder wrote: post #62
embedding-shape wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh, where is the court order about the Fastly stuff? Also funny that the only major one you seem to be missing is Vodafone, which is the ISP I have, and Fastly never been blocked here, although Vodafone is more than eager to add things to their block-list. > while my dev tools get blocked What dev tools are you talking about here, that depends on remote Cloudflare IPs? Maybe I got used to the overall crap internet s…

> What dev tools are you talking about here, that depends on remote Cloudflare IPs? It's never just been Cloudflare. There's even a blogpost from Vercel[1] about it when they had their exit nodes banned during the biggest outage last year: > This issue isn’t isolated to Vercel. Cloudflare, GitHub Pages, and BunnyCDN are also affected. [1] https://vercel.com/blog/update-on-spain-and-laliga-blocks-of...

Again, what dev tool are you using that get blocked because of these blocks? Is it Vercel you're unable to use during the blocks? Because my local Vercal installations keeps working just as well with no internet as with internet, so I'm guessing some Cloudflare IPs going offline won't have any effect either.

You again reference blog posts from more than a year ago, the situation here in Spain isn't the same today as it was back then, it isn't blocking as much as it used to, and surely if you're personally impacted by these blocks, like I am, then you'd notice the difference today compared to before?

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#64

Post by dbbk »

embedding-shape wrote: post #45
dbbk wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which IPs that you use daily are actually affected by this though? My own company would get taken down.

Maybe don't use Cloudflare in front of your business if you know that doing so will make it unavailable for 2-3 hours per week? These blocks been happening for years, if you're still letting you be affected, maybe you want to provide a poor service to your users? Most companies who used to use Cloudflare and actually want to be available to users, moved away a long time ago, it's a lot easier than many think.

Yes thanks that is what I did, you'll see I used the past tense

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#65

Post by embedding-shape »

dbbk wrote: post #64
embedding-shape wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe don't use Cloudflare in front of your business if you know that doing so will make it unavailable for 2-3 hours per week? These blocks been happening for years, if you're still letting you be affected, maybe you want to provide a poor service to your users? Most companies who used to use Cloudflare and actually want to be available to users, moved away a long time ago, it's a lot easier than many think.

Yes thanks that is what I did, you'll see I used the past tense

Right, but that's slightly misleading when we're talking about how people are affected (or not) by the current blocks today, not a year ago...

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#66

Post by bromuro »

breppp wrote: post #61
ktallett wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean other than Berlin, Malmö, Paris, London, Munich, and many others. Europe doesn't have so many huge companies but that's not a bad thing. We do have a lot of companies doing key work that may benefit society as a whole.

While there are outliers, most of the European economy is Spain rather than Sweden The European economy is still largely the same as pre-WW2, heavy machineries, cars, chemicals and these are becoming less relevant with Chinese competition. However, the move to tech never materialized like in the US, so no surprise when soccer becomes more important than anything else, it's the only long term viable export in bleak pl…

In Spain soccer is culturally important - not economically central. Everyone in the world knows teams like Real Madrid or Barcelona. On the other side Spain is home of major telecom and banking multinationals, high-speed rail networks, renewable energy... the startup ecosystem is strong in many cities.

Also european countries are deeply competitive in areas like industrial automation, aerospace, pharmaceuticals, semiconductors, telecommunications infrastructure, renewable energy systems, scientific instrumentation, petrochemicals etc.

Tourism is strong because the immense cultural heritage.

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#67

Post by iamnothere »

embedding-shape wrote: post #63
swiftcoder wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What dev tools are you talking about here, that depends on remote Cloudflare IPs? It's never just been Cloudflare. There's even a blogpost from Vercel[1] about it when they had their exit nodes banned during the biggest outage last year: > This issue isn’t isolated to Vercel. Cloudflare, GitHub Pages, and BunnyCDN are also affected. [1] https://vercel.com/blog/update-on-spain-and-laliga-blocks-of...

Again, what dev tool are you using that get blocked because of these blocks? Is it Vercel you're unable to use during the blocks? Because my local Vercal installations keeps working just as well with no internet as with internet, so I'm guessing some Cloudflare IPs going offline won't have any effect either. You again reference blog posts from more than a year ago, the situation here in Spain isn't the same today as…

“But how does it affect you PERSONALLY?”

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#68

Post by embedding-shape »

iamnothere wrote: post #67
embedding-shape wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, what dev tool are you using that get blocked because of these blocks? Is it Vercel you're unable to use during the blocks? Because my local Vercal installations keeps working just as well with no internet as with internet, so I'm guessing some Cloudflare IPs going offline won't have any effect either. You again reference blog posts from more than a year ago, the situation here in Spain isn't the same today as…

“But how does it affect you PERSONALLY?”

As someone who actually IS affected by this personally, I'd love to have any details from others affected too, not sure why this would be surprising.

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#69

Post by eskori »

embedding-shape wrote: post #57
swiftcoder wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe don't use Cloudflare They've also blocked Fastly in the past. I doubt any large CDN is immune. > if you know that doing so will make it unavailable for 2-3 hours per week? You expect companies all across the world to abandon their CDN providers because two countries (Spain and Italy) are being dicks about futbol?

> They've also blocked Fastly in the past. I doubt any large CDN is immune. When was this exactly? Last time I heard about Fastly and La Liga in the same paragraph, was when Fastly and La Liga joined up to combat piracy together, I'm guessing what you speak of predates this? Not finding any information about this online though, either in English nor Spanish. > You expect companies all across the world to abandon thei…

>If they've experienced these blocks for two years already, yet still are complaining about it instead of fixing it, then I expect them to actually try something else than just complaining about it.

I get why you would feel like this since it sounds pretty obvious. However, especially if we are being pragmatic, we should consider that reality is a little bit more complicated:

- We don't know the terms of their contract: how much does it cost them to use CloudFlare services, if they have a chance of "cancelling" just the CDN (in the case of them having more stuff contracted), etc.

- If they decided to pay for CloudFlare services and not some other companies, they might have reasons for not wanting to migrate.

- It does not change that a 3rd party unilaterally decided to start this practice (let's remember that even CloudFlare has finally talked about this and they are obviously pissed) affecting other businesses because apparently theirs is more important.

Honestly this doesn't affect me, but that doesn't change that I get why they feel like even if they could (which we don't know) move away from CloudFlare, they don't think they should just because Tebas said so.

EDIT: Formatting

Re: Spanish court declines to fine NordVPN over LaLiga piracy blocking order

#70

Post by iamnothere »

embedding-shape wrote: post #68
iamnothere wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“But how does it affect you PERSONALLY?”

As someone who actually IS affected by this personally, I'd love to have any details from others affected too, not sure why this would be surprising.

You seem to be in this thread downplaying the seriousness of the problem using the common trope I quoted above. The thing is, even if someone isn’t personally affected, it’s still a bad situation that a football league has this kind of power over internet infrastructure, and it’s ok for them to oppose that situation!
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