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I'm betting on ATProto

brittanyellich.com

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Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#61

Post by ajsnigrutin »

pastel8739 wrote: post #59
apitman wrote: post #32

> Social media was supposed to connect us, but most of it has turned into ads, division, and loneliness. I'm betting on ATProto as a way to fix that I disagree with the premise here. I think the core mechanics of social media, ie instant communication between random strangers about random topics, creates toxic interactions regardless of whether it's manipulated by engagement algorithms. Some of the most toxic convers…

This _isn’t_ the core mechanism of social media. When social media took off, Facebook and Instagram that really did allow you to connect with people that you knew from real life. Twitter was different, and more like microblogging, but I still see the real value of social media to be what the un-shitty versions of Facebook and Instagram were.

I always wondered about this.... in the beginning of instagram, i would follow maybe 30, 40 people, open it 2-3 times per day, and every time there would be 3-5 new photos of random stuff taken by those people (lunch/dinner plates, views from the window, beer glass on the bar, whatever).

Years later, i would follow 200 people, and i would open instagram once per day and all i'd see were random peoples photos and videos (reels? i don't know what they're called anymore), some from international influences, some like stuff that can be found on 9gag, etc. Even if i switched to "following", there would maybe be 1 photo made by a person I actually followed.

Did the algorithm make people stop posting their personal daily stuff? Did people change?

I guess it's even worse now, but i've uninstalled it a few years ago.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#62

Post by ninjagoo »

verdverm wrote: post #58
ninjagoo wrote: post #53

Not trustworthy. The providers mentioned in the article, blacksky and bluesky, presumably the most visible ones, do not allow signups with anonymous email providers even though they make you pass a human verification step. The link in the article for Blacksky (blackskyweb.xyz) has a dark pattern that attempts to get you sign up for bluesky instead of blacksky. Odd. The bigger issue is funding - currently appears to b…

> The biggest selling point - portable identity - is a mirage because the current providers do not give you the cryptographic keys to your identity. So they can simply lock you down, and your 'identity' is done. Here is one of many sites that help users de-risk, backup, and migrate: https://pdsmoover.com/

> Here is one of many sites that help users de-risk, backup, and migrate

Unfortunately, doesn't work if you're already locked out ...

And, you have to give this 3rd party site your username and password. Ouch.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#63

Post by foxylad »

garethsprice wrote: post #33

How does ATProto solve the problems that the last 10–20 years have shown seem intrinsic to all social media once it hits a certain scale? For example: A simple simulation of social networks rapidly reproduced three well-documented dysfunctions: partisan echo chambers, concentrated influence among a small elite, and amplification of polarized voices - creating a "social media prism" that distorts political discourse.…

I prefer the Fediverse to BlueSky, because it solves your three problems.

I choose to see every post on my (small country) instance, so if there is an echo chamber, it's an instance-shaped one. Which I like - I see the range of views prevalent in my small country. "Elite" posters depend on posting good content and are rewarded only by other people boosting their posts.

I tend to use Mastodon which makes finding a post's popularity a click away, and so emphasises posting for interest instead of outrage. This may also be an artifact of living in a small country that expects more civilised discourse from it's citizens.

Having no algorithm definitely makes the Fediverse more "boring" - I had to persevere after moving from Twitter. But I soon realised this was due to the lack of outrage, and that that was what I wanted, and what I was seeing was far more "real". Big fan now, and it's made my social media consumption a lot healthier.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#64

Post by CobrastanJorji »

I haven't really tried doing anything with ATProto, but I do regularly see content from some folks who are into it, and the thing I like about ATProto is how generally cheerful and friendly and happy the ATProto community is. They're out there with all of the zeal of the old blockchain devs, except without the inky black evil of that movement. Mind you, being a happy community mostly means projects that are either doomed or else ridiculous (looking at you, Doom-on-ATProto guys), but it feels like giddy old school hacks, and that makes me smile.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#65

Post by corndoge »

foxylad wrote: post #63
garethsprice wrote: post #33

How does ATProto solve the problems that the last 10–20 years have shown seem intrinsic to all social media once it hits a certain scale? For example: A simple simulation of social networks rapidly reproduced three well-documented dysfunctions: partisan echo chambers, concentrated influence among a small elite, and amplification of polarized voices - creating a "social media prism" that distorts political discourse.…

I prefer the Fediverse to BlueSky, because it solves your three problems. I choose to see every post on my (small country) instance, so if there is an echo chamber, it's an instance-shaped one. Which I like - I see the range of views prevalent in my small country. "Elite" posters depend on posting good content and are rewarded only by other people boosting their posts. I tend to use Mastodon which makes finding a pos…

Username checks out for fedi user ;)

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#66

Post by thombles »

gzread wrote: post #52
esbranson wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Fediverse did take off. Then large numbers of influential people got banned by randos and realized how much better and reliable (non-profit or not) corporate censors are.

How can you be banned from the fediverse?

I understand your pedantic point but let me give a realistic reply. If your account, or the account of somebody you like corresponding with, happens to be on an instance that falls into disfavour (not uncommon in my time there) then server bans come out and conversations become broken, even between parties who had no knowledge of the overarching drama. Good luck even understanding it if you aren’t a techie.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#68

Post by gnarlouse »

> I don’t think any social media platform was designed to do this. But it’s where most of them have ended up.

They were, quite literally, designed to do this. They needed to monetize the user base to pay for the server costs. Zuck wanted a business.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#69

Post by ninjagoo »

verdverm wrote: post #56
ninjagoo wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The credible exit allows for real competition This is a mirage. The ATProto providers don't give you the cryptographic keys to your identity, so if they lock down your account, you can't migrate.

While it is not the default for good reason (onboarding ux), you can establish your own keys and prevent that lock down. Here is one of many sites that help users de-risk, backup, and migrate: https://pdsmoover.com/

Looks like you have to give this 3rd party website your username as well as password. Ouch. On top of that, it doesn't work if you've been already locked out.

Re: I'm betting on ATProto

#70

Post by packetlost »

verdverm wrote: post #48
packetlost wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once someone builds a reasonable Google+ clone on ATProto or ActivityPub I'd probably switch to that. I don't think we've solved reputation when it comes to decentralized identity providers yet either.

For real, trust online is an open and hard problem. It's only going to get harder with ai bots running amok.

I have some serious designs for a federated reputation system that is, as far as I can tell, novel but I haven't had time to really refine it and develop a proof of concept. Just a pile of notes for now
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