Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

arstechnica.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 481 posts

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#61

Post by jp191919 »

richardubright wrote: post #43
jp191919 wrote: post #34

I wonder why existing hydro isn't utilized to it's potential. For instance, the Grand Coulee Dam has the highest capacity of any power station in the US of almost 7 MW but usually puts out about a third of that.

Looking at the data for lake that goes through the dam, it seems like they keep it at the same level. So it probably CAN make 7MW with more flow, but generally only flows at a state that puts out 2.

I looked into this more, and there is quite a bit of seasonal variability to contend with as well.

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#62

Post by hippo22 »

legitster wrote: post #29
ertgbnm wrote: post #22

I am reminded by the perhaps revisionist history but still applicable belief that slavery was really ended by industrialization making abolition economically advantageous and not actually a socially driven movement. (In reality it was certainly a convoluted mixture of the two I'm sure.) I hope we are in a similar era with regards to climate change. Surely there's a lot of money to be made in harnessing effectively un…

> I am reminded by the perhaps revisionist history but still applicable belief that slavery was really ended by industrialization making abolition economically advantageous and not actually a socially driven movement. (In reality it was certainly a convoluted mixture of the two I'm sure.) More or less. Adam Smith famously wrote that slavery was economically detrimental way back in 1776. It still took nearly 100 years…

[flagged]

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#63

Post by Kye »

epistasis wrote: post #23
Wistar wrote: post #11

Related: Alec Watson’s recent, and excellent, Technology Connections YouTube piece on renewable energy. “You are being misled about renewable energy technology” https://youtu.be/KtQ9nt2ZeGM?si=CJ_Tt9DnWSKH8eGC

I've had so many arguments with people that think replacing a continual supply of gasoline with solar panels and batteries means that we are just as dependent on the source of solar panels as we are on the source of gasoline. It's hard for people to visualize the massive shift here. It's the difference between needing to eat every single day, to merely needing to buy a 5-year supply and never having to worry about ea…

You also get 30 years of efficiency improvements and 20 years of capacity and reliability improvements when you replace them.

In practice: https://www.rte.ie/news/regional/2026/0116/1553440-mayo-wind...

>> "Each one of the new wind turbines will be capable of supplying more power to the national electricity grid than was generated by the entire Bellacorick wind farm."

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#64

Post by legitster »

peyton wrote: post #41
legitster wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am reminded by the perhaps revisionist history but still applicable belief that slavery was really ended by industrialization making abolition economically advantageous and not actually a socially driven movement. (In reality it was certainly a convoluted mixture of the two I'm sure.) More or less. Adam Smith famously wrote that slavery was economically detrimental way back in 1776. It still took nearly 100 years…

[flagged]

- The difference between Ben Franklin writing about farming in the 1770s and the civil war was that industrialization didn't hit the US until the 1810s/1820s when the first steel mills and steam engines were set up.

- "These people categorically did not want to start a farm; otherwise they would not have been facing famine." The vast majority of immigrants to the US at this time WERE farmers who were not allowed to own land in Europe. The reason they came to the North instead of the South is because they were largely not allowed to settle anywhere East of the Appalachians in the South. The South was staunchly anti-immigrant and barely had any cities at the time.

- At the outbreak of war, the Union army was almost entirely made up of American born volunteers. Later, immigrant brigades were enlisted, but most were highly regarded and commended and still made up less than half of the army.

- Your explanation cutely ignores the fact that Southern troops fired first in the Civil War

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#65

Post by tclancy »

peyton wrote: post #41
legitster wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am reminded by the perhaps revisionist history but still applicable belief that slavery was really ended by industrialization making abolition economically advantageous and not actually a socially driven movement. (In reality it was certainly a convoluted mixture of the two I'm sure.) More or less. Adam Smith famously wrote that slavery was economically detrimental way back in 1776. It still took nearly 100 years…

[flagged]

I liked it better when you guys called yourselves "Know Nothings". It made it easier to follow what was going on.

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#66

Post by hvb2 »

Retric wrote: post #27
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> With a bit of social pressure we should be able to extinct the fossil fuel industry Taking Europe versus China, California versus Texas, it seems like social pressure is less effective than markets. Let markets build the power source they want to build and lo and behold you get lots of solar and wind and batteries.

That’s true today, it wasn’t true when Germany was heavily subsidizing solar to get economies of scale going. Solar is historically a great example where public / private collaboration actually had a place. Even if today it’s time to let market forces work.

It's just a shame that they didn't end up enjoying the spoils very long. They had very good panels that were researched and produced in Germany but they got completely wiped out by cheap Chinese products

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#67

Post by rootusrootus »

Braxton1980 wrote: post #14
Zigurd wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about we try keeping big money out of politics and using ranked preference voting before we declare democracy obsolete? People have been studying that stuff.

If you ask most voters they'll say big money in politics is bad but if they know that why aren't they voting the issue? What is the money doing that the voter can't overcome?

They all think it's big money on the other side. Everything they learn themselves isn't the result of a big money campaign, it's honest truthful information that they were smart enough to find on their own.

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#68

Post by jp191919 »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #58
bob1029 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vogtle is probably producing the most electricity out of any generating plant in the US once you consider capacity factor.

Vogtle is also the most expensive electricity in the world, the only electricity costing more than $10,000 per kW.

And on the other end of the spectrum, grand coulee would be ~$1,500/kW in todays dollars.

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#69

Post by tclancy »

danans wrote: post #28
AnotherGoodName wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One nice thing about what’s happening is that politics are losing to reality. I’m not even sure how this became a left vs right issue in the first place (isn’t the right meant to be pro free market!?) but it doesn’t matter at this point anyway. Eg. Texas is doing really well in renewable rollouts (see the amount of battery capacity they are putting in - https://www.houstonpublicmedia.org/articles/news/energy-envi...…

> One nice thing about what’s happening is that politics are losing to reality. I’m not even sure how this became a left vs right issue in the first place (isn’t the right meant to be pro free market!?) No, the right isn't meant to be pro free-market. It's meant to protect the interests, longevity, and demand-capture of its donor industries, primarily fossil fuels extraction, processing, and distribution, but increas…

Yeah, I think the fact they are willing to dance to any new tune under Trump gives away the game completely. Whether it will make any difference to the audience is something I've stopped hoping about.

Re: Following 35% growth, solar has passed hydro on US grid

#70

Post by jeffbee »

tmellon2 wrote: post #35

Elon Musk mentioned that just a 100 square mile grid of Solar can power the entire USA. I did not believe it; a simple calculation later, I was convinced. The USA of yesteryear would have done this already and more. Sure other sources are required, but honestly we humans have to advance beyond burning dead things for fuel.

It bothers me that you attribute this to Elon Musk. This has been obvious to everyone for 75 years or more. The lecturer in my freshman thermodynamics class mentioned it, 35 years ago. In 1999, NREL scientists writing in the journal Science under the title "A Realizable Renewable Energy Future" made the specific claim about 10000 square miles.
Post reply on HN