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Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

medicalxpress.com

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Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#61

Post by gowld »

OP site is blogspam.

Here's the paper: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/41500513/

It's a review/summary of existing research, not anything new.

The fundamental problem with studying alternatives to therapy is that "being in a study" may be as effective as therapy! It's a structural placebo effect.

For a depressed person, "Exercise guided by a researcher" is different from "trying to make myself exercise".

> Authors' conclusions: Exercise may be moderately more effective than a control intervention for reducing symptoms of depression.

> Exercise appears to be no more or less effective than psychological or pharmacological treatments, though this conclusion is based on a few small trials.

> Long-term follow-up was rare.

Nothing new:

> The addition of 35 RCTs (at least 2526 participants) to this update has had very little effect on the estimate of the benefit of exercise on symptoms of depression.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#62

Post by jmye »

Sharlin wrote: post #18
pjerem wrote: post #5

I don't get what's new ? It's a known fact that exercise and good lifestyle are good for the mental health. But isn't the inability to maintain a good lifestyle one of the first symptoms of depression ?

Exactly. Depression is defined in part as being the inability to effectively do those things.

Why is this downvoted? It's literally two of the questions on the PHQ9, which is used to, you know, diagnose/measure depression.

Maybe some of y'all should stick to the javascript threads and stop pretending to be experts in healthcare. Listen more, speak less, kids.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#63

Post by [deleted] »

joe_mamba wrote: post #3

How to solve most cases of depression, make sure to get all these (if you can): - good diet with no junk food, alcohol, drugs and stimulants - regular exercise and outdoor time - good sleep hygiene - regular healthy social interactions - eliminate environmental stressors (job/financial stress, relationship stress, noise pollution, etc) Of course, not everyone can have everything and some of those aren't 100% under yo…

[deleted]

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#64

Post by weatherlite »

spiffytech wrote: post #50
resoluteteeth wrote: post #31

Exercise, therapy, and antidepressants have all been shown to have similar effect sizes for depression. It seems like some people take that to mean that therapy and antidepressants are pointless but unless there's some reason to think that the effects are mutually exclusive, a more reasonable interpretation is probably that it's good to try to do all of these things if possible if you are depressed.

And while they affect a similar percentage of people, they don't necessarily affect the same individuals. Same for therapy modalities, which often show similar efficacy in studies, but different efficacy for any given person. So you've got to try different things and figure out what works for you.

> Same for therapy modalities, which often show similar efficacy in studies, but different efficacy for any given person.

It's even more complicated than that - you can probably click well and succeed with one therapist and get a completely ineffective treatment by another therapist and I'm not sure we even understand why that well (saying one therapist is better than the other is not always true). With it being the way it is , I think A.I actually could be another tool for people to try; not currently but once it improves enough with memory and reliability (I know many people are gonna downvote this but what's your alternative?).

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#65

Post by bananaflag »

coffeefirst wrote: post #25
bananaflag wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> good diet with no junk food, alcohol, drugs and stimulants How does one get rid of the excitement of the expectation of eating chips or drinking cola etc?

You replace the thing you want to quit with a better thing. Try tea and seltzers, not because they’re healthy but because they’re interesting. There’s an infinite range of teas. And learning to cook changed my life. I get annoyed with almost all delivery now because I can do better.

I started drinking herbal teas some years ago, I heavily enjoy hibiscus and ginger because of their strong taste, to a lesser degree also cinnamon, licorice and peppermint, but most teas seem very bland.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#66

Post by gowld »

bananaflag wrote: post #8
joe_mamba wrote: post #3

How to solve most cases of depression, make sure to get all these (if you can): - good diet with no junk food, alcohol, drugs and stimulants - regular exercise and outdoor time - good sleep hygiene - regular healthy social interactions - eliminate environmental stressors (job/financial stress, relationship stress, noise pollution, etc) Of course, not everyone can have everything and some of those aren't 100% under yo…

> good diet with no junk food, alcohol, drugs and stimulants How does one get rid of the excitement of the expectation of eating chips or drinking cola etc?

You need to educate/brainwash yourself with operant conditioning that junk food makes you sick and good food makes you feel good.

The problem with depression in particular, though, is that self-harm--seeking behaviors is also a symptom, so that brainwashing can backfire.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#67

Post by joe_mamba »

jmye wrote: post #57
joe_mamba wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well yeah, but you gotta start somewhere, and it's not gonna get better if you drink cola, beer everyday and stay up until 2AM watching netflix.

> Well yeah, but you gotta start somewhere Wait, I thought those things solved depression ? Why are you hedging now? Did your initial analysis suck, and you're just now realizing it? Are you figuring out that maybe this is slightly more complex than "just be happy" and that maybe you're not the only person on the planet who's ever thought about this?

Your comment makes no sense. I never said "just be happy". Reformulate it and add more substance so we have something to talk about.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#68

Post by graemep »

nasir wrote: post #47
resoluteteeth wrote: post #31

Exercise, therapy, and antidepressants have all been shown to have similar effect sizes for depression. It seems like some people take that to mean that therapy and antidepressants are pointless but unless there's some reason to think that the effects are mutually exclusive, a more reasonable interpretation is probably that it's good to try to do all of these things if possible if you are depressed.

Mens sana in corpore sano Taking the antidepressant has become the dominant go to approach as it is more commercially profitable for the seller and easier to commit to for the taker.

Its also cheaper. A lot cheaper.

In the UK a GP can just lot prescribe an anti-depressant. There are waiting lists for NHS therapy and paying privately is expensive.

Re: Exercise has 'similar effect' to therapy, study on depression shows

#69

Post by weatherlite »

joe_mamba wrote: post #49
weatherlite wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At no point did we actually... go to a gym You really don't have to go to a gym if you don't like it , or do something "hard" that many people dislike like running. You can simply walk briskly for 150 minutes a week (which is the recommended dose, and which 80% of Americans and other Westerners don't meet). That is time outside (vitamin D) + moving your entire body - less chronic pain, better joints, better bones e…

>You really don't have to go to a gym if you don't like it ... You can simply walk briskly for 150 minutes a week I don't like flossing and brushing my teeth either, but yet I still do it regularly. In fact, I never met anyone who brushes they teeth out of enjoyment, but out of habit. Similarly, the habit of exercise(and other health related activities) needs to be cultivated, you don't have to like it, you just do i…

I'm with you up to a point. If you have time watch Dr Liberman's video about why people resist exercise so much despite wanting to do it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vzS7-MtObo&

There's nothing new here, we all know this, but he brings the point home very well. I think brisk walking is within the realm of possibilites for most people. Running and lifting - idk. I personally love it but so many people I know have such a huge psychological resistance to doing it. So I say lets get people to at least walk!

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