Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

news.ycombinator.com

61–70 of 71 posts

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#61
post #57

6502 Assembly Language Programming by Leventhal. This is how I learned. This book is great. I have the worn paper copy sitting 6 feet behind me as I type this. It's worth getting a paper copy if that is still possible. https://archive.org/details/6502-assembly-language-programmi...

Love this. I had a copy 40 years ago.

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#62
If you have absolutely no experience with assembly then I'd suggest starting very simple with a modern microcontroller.

I have a special place in my heart for the original pic16f84a the modern equivalent is the pic16F1827.

Which uses the same 35 core instructions.

AVR8 is a close second.

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#63
> And is it absolutely necessary to learn BASIC before Assembly

If you don't have experience programming, learning BASIC before Assembly will be super helpful before you learn 6502.

If you only have experience programming in modern languages (Javascript, etc.), learning the Applesoft BASIC will also be super helpful before you learn 6502, as you'll learn how to get by without ...

A) the following language conveniences:

- function names (it's all line numbers),

- variables with more than 2 letters,

and

B) the following modern concepts:

- function calls (no stack other than for GOSUB, use subroutines with dedicated variables for passing parameters instead),

- scoped variables (everything is global),

- dynamic allocation (you have to DIM arrays with the max size upfront),

- anything object-like like structs or classes (hack it with multi-dimensional arrays)

- other fancy stuff like callbacks, promises, hashtables and any other data structure beyond arrays.

and that will nicely prepare you for 6502 assembly (or any kind of assembly really). The advantage in 6502 assembly is you can implement most of B) yourself if you do need it.

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#64
The Apple II Reference Manual includes assembly listings (with full comments!) for the Monitor ROM and Autostart ROM, the mini-assembler, floating point routines, and a very nice 16-bit "pseudo machine interpreter" called SWEET 16. Most of which was written by Steve Wozniak. Learned a lot from this book back in the day.

Here's a link from archive.org. It's not the best scan, but you can easily find other copies.

https://archive.org/details/applerefjan78/page/n69/mode/2up

If you're feeling adventurous, you can find assembly listings for the AppleSoft BASIC language (though maybe only from third parties). It's pretty huge.

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#67
[Off TOpic somewhat] This post made me immediately recall, the hours I spent playing Apple Invaders, 1979

Pinball Construction Set, by Bill Bludge

Chop Lifter, modeled on 1979–1981 Iran Hostage Crisis, Dan Gorlin, Brøderbund 1982

Castle Wolfenstein (1981) (Muse) by Silas Warner

Red Alert (1981) Olaf Lubeck, Broderbund

I still have some of these original games and the artwork in the shed.....

All classic Apple games of very early 80s

At the time, the programming was recognized as amazing, the sound and graphics. It was a marvel that it was achieved on such a low resource machine ....

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#68
RE "....Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II...."

Suggest to look at some of the archives of old Apple Magazines from around the Apple I era , cira late 70s and early 80s.

Some of them would have had assembly language programming columns. I recall one Named Softtalk , but there where many. There are other Sites than Archive.org. Some archive sites solely devoted to early apple computers like Apple 2

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#69
post #19
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have any programming experience.

Google can be very helpful for these types of queries: https://www.google.com/search?q=apple+2+game+programming+tut... Formulating questions is a valuable skill as is finding existing resources. As some one from that era, it is truly amazing how much information there is online about all aspects of 8 bit computers

Nothing wrong with internet searches (though I find Google is most useful for results from Google sites).

But HN is full of 6502 enthusiasts, so I approve of tapping their collective wisdom to discover personal favorites and recommendations.

Unlike modern computers, 8-bit systems were expected to be programmed by their owners! As a result there are many books from the 8-bit, pre-internet era explaining exactly how to do so, and many of those books are conveniently available on the modern internet (perhaps via a google or other search, or on archive.org, etc.) Many systems also came with user instruction manuals explaining how to program them.

Here is the Apple II BASIC manual from 1978:

https://archive.org/details/Apple_II_Basic_Programming_Manua...

Note how it explains everything from scratch, including how to hook the Apple II up to a TV, how to use the keyboard, and how to start up BASIC.

BASIC was designed as a simple but effective programming language that could be learned by computing novices (first year college students) in an afternoon. Here is the original Dartmouth BASIC manual (23 pages long!) from 1964:

https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/basicmanual_1964.pdf

Re: Ask HN: Books to learn 6502 ASM and the Apple II

#70
post #57

6502 Assembly Language Programming by Leventhal. This is how I learned. This book is great. I have the worn paper copy sitting 6 feet behind me as I type this. It's worth getting a paper copy if that is still possible. https://archive.org/details/6502-assembly-language-programmi...

Looks like a nice book, and it appears that he wrote books on other microprocessors (8080/8085, 8086, Z-80, Z8000, 6800, 6809, 68000... even SPARC apparently) as well. I'd like to find a full version of the 68000 book, which archive.org only seems to offer a preview of.
Post reply on HN