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FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

fex-emu.com

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Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#61

Post by sintax »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #26
jasonjmcghee wrote: post #23

Curious how this will impact the major games that are incompatible due to denuvo type stuff

IIUC that DRM involves kernel level tricks and attestation, which means it'll basically never happen. Online gaming looks similarly doomed.

Denuvo anti-tamper DRM doesn't use kernel level tricks, it's all userspace and works just fine on Linux/Proton. It's the kernel level anti-cheats that don't work on Linux. And some user level anti cheats (like AntiCheat Expert) that only work on the Steam Deck as they check the CPU/GPU of the system and refuse to work if it's not the one in the Steam Deck (which also means those don't work on platforms like the ROG Ally).

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#62

Post by lugu »

astrange wrote: post #16
jsheard wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that Rosetta sidesteps a bunch of tricky memory model issues by using non-standard hardware extensions only present in Apple Silicon, so even if Apple did share Rosetta, which they certainly won't, it wouldn't work properly on Valves hardware anyway.

It's not only present in Apple Silicon, it's just not required by the ARM standard. Fujitsu also has an ARM64 CPU with TSO.

Nice article on this topic: https://lwn.net/Articles/970907/

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#63

Post by chadaustin »

astrange wrote: post #40
wmf wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a bunch of undocumented flags and instructions beyond TSO.

Trust me on this one?

https://dougallj.wordpress.com/2022/11/09/why-is-rosetta-2-f...

> Apple M1 has an undocumented extension that, when enabled, ensures instructions like ADDS, SUBS and CMP compute PF and AF and store them as bits 26 and 27 of NZCV respectively, providing accurate emulation with no performance penalty.

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#64

Post by [deleted] »

jsheard wrote: post #10
sitkack wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too bad Arm doesn't allow architectural licenses, because this is exactly the kind of thing Valve and the FEX developers would want to extend the ISA to support. I bet we see a RISC-V backend to FEX in the next 6 months, it probably already exists in a private repo. FEX is the shootstring, extra special discount budget (not maligning) version of Rosetta. Apple should sell Rosetta to Valve.

My understanding is that Rosetta sidesteps a bunch of tricky memory model issues by using non-standard hardware extensions only present in Apple Silicon, so even if Apple did share Rosetta, which they certainly won't, it wouldn't work properly on Valves hardware anyway.

[deleted]

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#65

Post by kokada »

dontlaugh wrote: post #59
scotty79 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rosetta is abandonware: https://developer.apple.com/documentation/apple-silicon/abou... Why would a company on its way to the moon, entrust such an important project as translation layer between two major architectures to a single rinky-dinky corp that got rich selling common electronics marketed as luxury fluff, that's on the decline and has head so far stuck up its butt that it thinks it can do whatever it wants, i…

I don’t know if the two companies have such different futures. The games industry as a whole is in potentially terminal decline, have you seen all of the redundancies lately?

The AAA games industry with their multi-million budgets and "being too big to fail" mentality is on decline. It seems that anything that is not a new Call of Duty is considered not worth by the industry.

But smaller games and indie studios are thriving. We got lots of very interesting indie games this year.

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#66

Post by Lightkey »

cubefox wrote: post #53
sitkack wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just used by, Valve is sponsoring FEX. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45903610#:~:text=Valve%...

I wouldn't call this random comment reliable testimony that they are sponsoring FEX.

https://gamersnexus.net/pc-builds-news/valve-steam-machine-d... "Valve has devoted significant resources to the development of FEX emulation."

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#67

Post by GCUMstlyHarmls »

adgjlsfhk1 wrote: post #28
globalnode wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does that mean I can run windows games on my rpi? (In theory at least)

Yes (just possibly at ~2 fps)

Into the Breach is back on the menu.

There's probably a mountain of x86 games that would not need to hit above 15-30fps to be fun.

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#68

Post by LeonM »

open-paren wrote: post #2

> FEX allows you to run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices, similar to qemu-user and box64. It offers broad compatibility with both 32-bit and 64-bit binaries, and it can be used alongside Wine/Proton to play Windows games. > It supports forwarding API calls to host system libraries like OpenGL or Vulkan to reduce emulation overhead. An experimental code cache helps minimize in-game stuttering as much as possibl…

[flagged]

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#69

Post by wtallis »

overfeed wrote: post #45
donkeylazy456 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Qualcomm's linux support is not.

That's true Qualcomm in general, but is fortunately outdated for the Snapdragon Elite X (and only the X). Qualcomm has been upstreaming patches to Linus' tree[1] - but only for the Elite X - the Elite P processors get the classic Qualcomm treatment. 1. https://www.qualcomm.com/developer/blog/2024/05/upstreaming-...

You're mangling Qualcomm's branding to the point that it's impossible to be sure what you're trying to say. Qualcomm's current laptop SoCs are called "Snapdragon X Elite" or "Snapdragon X Plus" or "Snapdragon X", all derived from various bins of two SoC designs, and all pretty much in the same boat for driver support purposes. "Snapdragon X2 Elite" and lesser siblings are due in the first half of next year, so a respectable degree of Linux support would mean having driver support for those chips in an upstream kernel release now so that there might be a mainstream distro supporting the hardware at some point in the quarter after the hardware ships.

Re: FEX-emu – Run x86 applications on ARM64 Linux devices

#70

Post by thehias »

cubefox wrote: post #53
sitkack wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just used by, Valve is sponsoring FEX. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45903610#:~:text=Valve%...

I wouldn't call this random comment reliable testimony that they are sponsoring FEX.

Man, Fex is Valve, Valve is Fex! The steam logo is right there in the logo!

https://files.mastodon.social/accounts/headers/110/652/595/6...

Center of left side, it is a Valve product. All main devs are employed by Valve.

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