Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

riksbank.se

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 581 posts

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#61

Post by messe »

john01dav wrote: post #48
mrtksn wrote: post #9

It's not about paying by cash but paying by card offline. How is this going to be implemented I wonder. On planes they often accept credit cards even when there's no internet. I assume this is a trust in-credit-based system because they don't accept debit cards, i.e. if you are worth being trusted with a card you can have your sandwich now and we will take care of the bank processing once we are on the ground. So may…

On every flight I've been on recently, Internet was available to passengers. Surely a few KiB (I assume that this is what a credit or debit transaction requires) could go over this system?

US domestic? I've found it's somewhat rare to see here in the EU, but there are a few airlines that offer it.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#62

Post by mrtksn »

fpoling wrote: post #57

Extracting keys from a modern SIM card is very difficult. The cost is way above 10K USD. So a payment card in offline mode is absolutely possible as long as one limits the payments to few hundreds USD. The bigger challenge is an offline terminal that can easy accumulate tenths of USD in case of a long outage. But then compared with cards the terminal may have better protection.

What makes it over 10K USD?

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#63

Post by alexey-salmin »

mrtksn wrote: post #38
al_borland wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t see why not, they can be run just like a credit card through the same network. When a debit card prompts for a PIN, don’t enter it, press submit, and it runs as credit instead of debit, but functionally works the same as far as the card-holder is concerned. It might take slightly longer to settle, and the merchant likely gets charged higher fees, but it works just fine. When I got my first debit card 20+ year…

Having a credit card requires some amount of trustworthiness. Anyone can get a debit card, they even sell it in supermarkets.

Normally in supermarkets they sell prepaid cards which are distinct from both credit and debit ones. Visa and Mastercard support all three types.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#64

Post by ThePowerOfFuet »

mrtksn wrote: post #38
al_borland wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t see why not, they can be run just like a credit card through the same network. When a debit card prompts for a PIN, don’t enter it, press submit, and it runs as credit instead of debit, but functionally works the same as far as the card-holder is concerned. It might take slightly longer to settle, and the merchant likely gets charged higher fees, but it works just fine. When I got my first debit card 20+ year…

Having a credit card requires some amount of trustworthiness. Anyone can get a debit card, they even sell it in supermarkets.

You're confusing debit with prepaid; they are classified differently and merchants can determine one from the other.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#65

Post by wat10000 »

mrtksn wrote: post #46
pjmlp wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly like that most likely, I am old enough to remember those machines where credit cards left their mark on the receipt, that is why their numbers are higher than the card. Here, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card_imprinter

Very interesting, never heard of these. Thank you.

I suddenly feel very old.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#66

Post by veeti »

daneel_w wrote: post #50
Etheryte wrote: post #5

Some context might be useful here. I spent some time living Sweden not too long ago and Swedes practically don't use cash. It's usually not said out loud, but cash is often considered to be dirty and criminal, to the point that most don't have any at all. Digital payments are very convenient and deeply integrated, so long as you have a local ID which allows you use the local payment system Swish etc. This worked nice…

> "It's usually not said out loud, but cash is often considered to be dirty and criminal ..." Are you sure this isn't impression you've gotten from isolated reactions involving a small number of individuals, perhaps just a single individual? I can't relate to the sentiment at all, having lived here for just over three decades and experiencing the popularity shift from cash to debit card. I can, in fact, not recall a…

Sweden has introduced civil asset forfeiture where the mere possession of cash can make you a suspect [1]. It's coming from the very top.

https://archive.ph/v7TRe

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#67

Post by adrianpike »

pjmlp wrote: post #18
mrtksn wrote: post #9

It's not about paying by cash but paying by card offline. How is this going to be implemented I wonder. On planes they often accept credit cards even when there's no internet. I assume this is a trust in-credit-based system because they don't accept debit cards, i.e. if you are worth being trusted with a card you can have your sandwich now and we will take care of the bank processing once we are on the ground. So may…

Exactly like that most likely, I am old enough to remember those machines where credit cards left their mark on the receipt, that is why their numbers are higher than the card. Here, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card_imprinter

We did sailing charters growing up and had one of these on the boat, I was in charge of it and the sound & feel of the CH-CHUNK is seared into my memories like nothing else. We never got any declines, but I always wondered how that reconciliation process actually worked out.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#68

Post by cowsandmilk »

pjmlp wrote: post #18
mrtksn wrote: post #9

It's not about paying by cash but paying by card offline. How is this going to be implemented I wonder. On planes they often accept credit cards even when there's no internet. I assume this is a trust in-credit-based system because they don't accept debit cards, i.e. if you are worth being trusted with a card you can have your sandwich now and we will take care of the bank processing once we are on the ground. So may…

Exactly like that most likely, I am old enough to remember those machines where credit cards left their mark on the receipt, that is why their numbers are higher than the card. Here, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card_imprinter

Wikipedia claims they aren’t being used in the 2020’s, but I’ve still seen stores in the past year pull them out when the internet is down.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#69

Post by mikestew »

mrtksn wrote: post #46
pjmlp wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly like that most likely, I am old enough to remember those machines where credit cards left their mark on the receipt, that is why their numbers are higher than the card. Here, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card_imprinter

Very interesting, never heard of these. Thank you.

“Never heard of these”, meanwhile I was remembering a credit card that I used so often that I wore the coloring off the raised numbers.

And I guess if one has never seen these, I need to explain. In order to leave an impression on the carbon paper (I should probably explain that, too, huh?), a fair amount of pressure was needed (those old card imprinters didn’t require a gym membership, but a child could not operate one). That rolling pressure would eventually wear on the surface of the card, and turn the numbers white when the outer layer wore through.

Re: Offline card payments should be possible no later than 1 July 2026

#70

Post by daneel_w »

veeti wrote: post #66
daneel_w wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "It's usually not said out loud, but cash is often considered to be dirty and criminal ..." Are you sure this isn't impression you've gotten from isolated reactions involving a small number of individuals, perhaps just a single individual? I can't relate to the sentiment at all, having lived here for just over three decades and experiencing the popularity shift from cash to debit card. I can, in fact, not recall a…

Sweden has introduced civil asset forfeiture where the mere possession of cash can make you a suspect [1]. It's coming from the very top. https://archive.ph/v7TRe

I fully understand why the Swedish government wants to get rid of cash. What I'm saying is that the people simply don't feel that cash is in any way dirty.
Post reply on HN