Live data from Hacker News

OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

techinasia.com

61–70 of 720 posts

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#61

I am curious to see how this compares against where Amazon was in 2000. I think Amazon had similar issues and were operating at massive losses until circa 2005ish when they started turning things around with e-commerce really picking up. If the revenue keeps going up and losses keep going down, it may reach that inflection point in a few years. For that to happen, the cost of AI datacenter have to go down massively.

Fundamentally different business models.

Amazon had huge capital investments that got less painful as it scaled. Amazon also focuses on cash flow vs profit. Even early on it generated a lot of cash, it just reinvested that back into the business which meant it made a “loss” on paper.

OpenAI is very different. Their “capital” expense depreciation (model development) has a really ugly depreciation curve. It’s not like building a fulfillment network that you can use for decades. That’s not sustainable for much longer. They’re simply burning cash like there’s no tomorrow. Thats only being kept afloat by the AI bubble hype, which looks very close to bursting. Absent a quick change, this will get really ugly.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#62
post #51
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both numbers are entirely ludicrous - highly skilled people are certainly quite valuable. But it's insane that these companies aren't just training up more internally. The 50x developer is a pervasive myth in our industry and it's one that needs to be put to rest.

> training up more internally Why would employees stay after getting trained if they have a better offer?

A tamper-proof electronic collar with some C4.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#63
post #34

I'd be pretty worried as a shareholder. Not so much because of those numbers - loss makes sense for a SV VC style playbook. ...but rather that they're doing that while Chinese competitors are releasing models in vaguely similar ballpark under Apache license. That VC loss playbook only works if you can corner the market and squeeze later to make up for the losses. And you don't corner something that has freakin apache…

> but rather that they're doing that while Chinese competitors are releasing models in vaguely similar ballpark under Apache license.

The LLM isn't 100% of the product... the open source is just part. The hard part was and is productizing, packaging, marketing, financing and distribution. A model by itself is just one part of the puzzle, free or otherwise. In other words, my uncle Bill and my mother can and do use ChatGPT. Fill in the blank open-source model? Maybe as a feature in another product.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#64

Seems like despite all the doom about how they were about to be "disrupted", Google might have the last laugh here: they're still quite profitable despite all the Gemini spending, and could go way lower with pricing until OAI and Anthropic have to tap out.

Google also has the advantage of having their own hardware. They aren't reliant on buying Nvidia, and have been developing and using their TPUs for a long time. Google's been an "AI" company since forever

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#65
post #5

$2.5B in stock comp for about 3,000 employees. that’s roughly $830k per person in just six months. Almost 60% of their revenue went straight back to staff.

That’s how it should be, spread the wealth.

It doesn't seem that spread out.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#66
post #58

I think the most interesting numbers in this piece (ignoring the stock compensation part) are: $4.3 billion in revenue - presumably from ChatGPT customers and API fees $6.7 billion spent on R&D $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? I don't remember seeing many ads for ChatGPT but clearly I've not been paying attention in the right places. Open question for me: where does the cost of ru…

> $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is?

Not sure where/how I read it, but remember coming across articles stating OpenAI has some agreements with schools, universities and even the US government. The cost of making those happen would probably go into "sales & marketing".

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#67
post #58

I think the most interesting numbers in this piece (ignoring the stock compensation part) are: $4.3 billion in revenue - presumably from ChatGPT customers and API fees $6.7 billion spent on R&D $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? I don't remember seeing many ads for ChatGPT but clearly I've not been paying attention in the right places. Open question for me: where does the cost of ru…

Hard to know where it is in this breakdown but I would expect them to have the proper breakdowns. We know on the inference side it’s profitable but not to what scale.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#68
post #58

I think the most interesting numbers in this piece (ignoring the stock compensation part) are: $4.3 billion in revenue - presumably from ChatGPT customers and API fees $6.7 billion spent on R&D $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? I don't remember seeing many ads for ChatGPT but clearly I've not been paying attention in the right places. Open question for me: where does the cost of ru…

> $2 billion on sales and marketing

Probably an accounting trick to account for non-paying-customers or the week of “free” cursor GPT-5 use.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#69
post #66
post #58

I think the most interesting numbers in this piece (ignoring the stock compensation part) are: $4.3 billion in revenue - presumably from ChatGPT customers and API fees $6.7 billion spent on R&D $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? I don't remember seeing many ads for ChatGPT but clearly I've not been paying attention in the right places. Open question for me: where does the cost of ru…

> $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? Not sure where/how I read it, but remember coming across articles stating OpenAI has some agreements with schools, universities and even the US government. The cost of making those happen would probably go into "sales & marketing".

This will include the people cost of sales and marketing teams.

Re: OpenAI's H1 2025: $4.3B in income, $13.5B in loss

#70
post #66
post #58

I think the most interesting numbers in this piece (ignoring the stock compensation part) are: $4.3 billion in revenue - presumably from ChatGPT customers and API fees $6.7 billion spent on R&D $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? I don't remember seeing many ads for ChatGPT but clearly I've not been paying attention in the right places. Open question for me: where does the cost of ru…

> $2 billion on sales and marketing - anyone got any idea what this is? Not sure where/how I read it, but remember coming across articles stating OpenAI has some agreements with schools, universities and even the US government. The cost of making those happen would probably go into "sales & marketing".

Most folks that are not an engineer building is likely classified as “sales and marketing.” “Developer advocates” “solutions architects” and all that stuff included.
Post reply on HN