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How can I influence others without manipulating them?

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Re: How can I influence others without manipulating them?

#61

Post by self_awareness »

Influence is manipulation, plain and simple.

The key question is whether we use our moral compass when we influence or manipulate. Personally, I don’t see anything wrong with moral manipulation.

The real inquiry is about the moral values we prioritize. Are we only focused on our own gain? Do we genuinely aim to help others? Or are we somewhere in the middle?

When we seek to benefit others, is it truly for them, or is it more about our own satisfaction from doing something “good”? Do those “good” actions genuinely help everyone, or merely specific groups at the cost of others? Perhaps someone has lost out because of our so-called “good” deeds.

By pondering and answering these questions, you'll be able to influence others without resorting to non-moral manipulation.

Re: How can I influence others without manipulating them?

#62

Post by saagarjha »

voxl wrote: post #35
dsubburam wrote: post #9

Persuasion that happens in good faith is a two-way street. You explain your position, but also truly listen to theirs. If you are prepared to change your own position based on what they say, then you can hope that they might change theirs based on what you say. If it is truly two way in this sense, including your best efforts to extract from the other party their strongest, potentially unexpected, arguments for their…

The earth is not flat. This is indisputable fact. Yet, much ink has been spilt on arguments to the contrary. Refuting some of these arguments is quite difficult, honestly, but none of the arguments really matter because they reject all the convincing evidence as conspiracy or magic. In this way, what you suggest demands significant labor on the part of the person arguing an obvious fact against an ideologue who will…

It’s not? There’s ample evidence to support the earth being round. If you have legitimate evidence to the contrary I’d be happy to listen to you.

Re: How can I influence others without manipulating them?

#64

Post by obioneknowsit »

By setting a "good" example during a time they are in an unfavorable or weaker position. Which could mean remaining firm on the outside while providing space for their ego to transform their loss into a learning experience and improve their performance. It's written this way because the methods are different for the enabler and/or the receiver. I hope you understand obi one!

Re: How can I influence others without manipulating them?

#69

Post by vanviegen »

dijit wrote: post #52
voxl wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The earth is not flat. This is indisputable fact. Yet, much ink has been spilt on arguments to the contrary. Refuting some of these arguments is quite difficult, honestly, but none of the arguments really matter because they reject all the convincing evidence as conspiracy or magic. In this way, what you suggest demands significant labor on the part of the person arguing an obvious fact against an ideologue who will…

You’re being downvoted by idealists. I was an idealist, so I understand the position. Ideally, you explain your position and they explain theirs and it’s an open dialogue. Truthfully, you could be wrong about any number of things you have resolute conviction about- even things you believe are well evidenced. The cynic in me is aware that actually us as individuals have finite time and mental energy to keep debating t…

> You’re being downvoted by idealists.

No, I think they are being downvoted because they dismiss a thoughtful comment that makes a good attempt at providing an actual answer to the question at hand as "full of shit".

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