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How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

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Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#61

Post by zkmon »

This is the "portal/broker" phenomenon that is gripping all domains for last couple of decades. Consumer and producer are de-linked by a third-party layer that is making things better for both at the cost of dependency on the layer for both.

When you order on amazon, you no longer deal with the merchant. When you order food, you no longer directly pay the restaurant. When you ask for information from web, you no longer want to deal with idiosyncrasies of the content authors (page styles, navigation, fragmentation of content, ads etc).

Is it bad for content owners? Yes, because people won't visit your pages any longer, affecting your ad revenue. Is it compensated? Now this is where it differs from amazon and food delivery apps. There is no compensation for the lost ad revenue. If the only purpose of your content is ads, well, that is gone.

But wait, a whole lot of content on internet is funded by ads. And Google's bread and butter lies in the ad revenues of the sites. Why would they kill their geese? Because they have no other option. They just need to push the evolution and be there when future arrives. They hope to be part of the future somehow.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#62

Post by dns_snek »

carlosjobim wrote: post #47
imoverclocked wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO, that’s a pretty entitled view of the whole process. I’ve published software under a license that disallows certain uses of it. Just because it is published doesn’t mean that it should be usable in any way that anybody wants.

You're asking a lot from law enforcement if you're giving away something for free and then demand that law enforcement make sure that people use the thing exactly as you have mandated. It's akin to me putting up billboards and stickers around town and then demanding to decide who gets to look at them. Same thing with online publishers. If they want to control who uses their content and how, there's a tried and true s…

This is why we can't have nice things. People contribute to communal efforts such as free software but inevitably some assholes come around to exploit everyone's good will and their contributions for their own gain. That's not enough of course, so you further demoralize them for being stupid enough to believe that they would be protected by laws that were specifically designed to protect them, and mock them for pursuing higher ideals than immediate personal enrichment through paywalls.

And no, sharing your labor for free with anyone who wants it (as long as they agree to a few simple rules) is nothing like putting up a billboard and "demanding to decide who gets to look at them".

The entire premise of billboards is to force people to look at something they had no intention or desire to look at. You weren't forced to search for, look at, or use someone's free software or other type of content. You did so willingly and intentionally.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#63

Post by omnimus »

chatmasta wrote: post #43
hermitcrab wrote: post #34

I resent Google (and other AIs) scraping and repurposing all the copyright material from my software product website, without even asking. But, if I block them, there is very little chance I am going to get mentioned in their AI summary.

Yeah, this seems like a great way to ensure Google AI summarizes the second best result behind your own. And in many cases, like when the result is about your product or company or someone associated with it, that could be very bad for you. Imagine if “PayPal sucks” is rank 2 for “how to withdraw from PayPal,” but the official website blocked the AI summary so instead it comes from the “PayPal sucks” domain… Honestly…

I don't think you realize this is temporary state for Google. Their overall plan called Google zero is to provide answers fully like LLMs and never link to any other website (zero links). This has been their long term goal since the moment it was clear that the industry will manage to avoid copyright legal issues by training LLMs.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#64

Post by phendrenad2 »

pupppet wrote: post #7

I don't understand how these AI summaries don't cannibalize Google's future profits. Google lives off ads that direct users to websites, websites they are doing their damnedest to make unnecessary. Who will be building future websites that nobody visits.

They are undoubtedly cutting into profits. When I Google now, I wait for the AI summary (come to think of it, the fact that it takes 3-5 seconds to appear might not be organic...) and then click the references, rather than clicking through to search results. They're probably losing a LOT of reason for people to fight for SEO now. Why bother, Google users will just read the summary instead.

I suspect that they're hoping to "win" the AI war, get a monopoly, and then enshittify the whole thing. Good luck with that.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#65

Post by carlosjobim »

dns_snek wrote: post #62
carlosjobim wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're asking a lot from law enforcement if you're giving away something for free and then demand that law enforcement make sure that people use the thing exactly as you have mandated. It's akin to me putting up billboards and stickers around town and then demanding to decide who gets to look at them. Same thing with online publishers. If they want to control who uses their content and how, there's a tried and true s…

This is why we can't have nice things. People contribute to communal efforts such as free software but inevitably some assholes come around to exploit everyone's good will and their contributions for their own gain. That's not enough of course, so you further demoralize them for being stupid enough to believe that they would be protected by laws that were specifically designed to protect them, and mock them for pursu…

Well then it's like handing out free birthday cake recipes in the middle of the street to anybody who passes by and then calling the police later demanding that they arrest people, because they're baking the cake even though it's not their birthday.

Recipes are a good real world example of open source working properly. Anybody is free to use and improve. And anybody is free to not share their recipes or improvements with the public.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#66

Post by dangus »

omnimus wrote: post #63
chatmasta wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, this seems like a great way to ensure Google AI summarizes the second best result behind your own. And in many cases, like when the result is about your product or company or someone associated with it, that could be very bad for you. Imagine if “PayPal sucks” is rank 2 for “how to withdraw from PayPal,” but the official website blocked the AI summary so instead it comes from the “PayPal sucks” domain… Honestly…

I don't think you realize this is temporary state for Google. Their overall plan called Google zero is to provide answers fully like LLMs and never link to any other website (zero links). This has been their long term goal since the moment it was clear that the industry will manage to avoid copyright legal issues by training LLMs.

This “Google Zero” thing (which is just the name of a theory made up by some guy) is missing the part where Google figures out a way replace its ad revenue.

If Google doesn’t take you to someone else’s website or app, they can’t charge advertisers any money.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#67

Post by elashri »

zkmon wrote: post #61

This is the "portal/broker" phenomenon that is gripping all domains for last couple of decades. Consumer and producer are de-linked by a third-party layer that is making things better for both at the cost of dependency on the layer for both. When you order on amazon, you no longer deal with the merchant. When you order food, you no longer directly pay the restaurant. When you ask for information from web, you no long…

> Consumer and producer are de-linked by a third-party layer that is making things better for both at the cost of dependency on the layer for both

> Is it bad for content owners? Yes, because people won't visit your pages any longer, affecting your ad revenue.

So it is actually better for the both sides. One is getting hurt in this transition process.

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#68

Post by SebFender »

omnimus wrote: post #63
chatmasta wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, this seems like a great way to ensure Google AI summarizes the second best result behind your own. And in many cases, like when the result is about your product or company or someone associated with it, that could be very bad for you. Imagine if “PayPal sucks” is rank 2 for “how to withdraw from PayPal,” but the official website blocked the AI summary so instead it comes from the “PayPal sucks” domain… Honestly…

I don't think you realize this is temporary state for Google. Their overall plan called Google zero is to provide answers fully like LLMs and never link to any other website (zero links). This has been their long term goal since the moment it was clear that the industry will manage to avoid copyright legal issues by training LLMs.

Google had LLM's long before OpenAI did ...

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#69

Post by trogdor »

dangus wrote: post #66
omnimus wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you realize this is temporary state for Google. Their overall plan called Google zero is to provide answers fully like LLMs and never link to any other website (zero links). This has been their long term goal since the moment it was clear that the industry will manage to avoid copyright legal issues by training LLMs.

This “Google Zero” thing (which is just the name of a theory made up by some guy) is missing the part where Google figures out a way replace its ad revenue. If Google doesn’t take you to someone else’s website or app, they can’t charge advertisers any money.

Couldn’t they just show ads alongside the search result?

Re: How to stop Google from AI-summarising your website

#70

Post by omnimus »

trogdor wrote: post #69
dangus wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This “Google Zero” thing (which is just the name of a theory made up by some guy) is missing the part where Google figures out a way replace its ad revenue. If Google doesn’t take you to someone else’s website or app, they can’t charge advertisers any money.

Couldn’t they just show ads alongside the search result?

I am sure they can figure out even better. Like put the product purchase link in the answer.
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