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StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

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Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it's "legit", it shouldn't be using unencrypted HTTP.

Why? Should it use the dict protocol, then?

Because without HTTPS it's trivial to MITM that clipboard content if they're always sending it via http.

People in your coffee shop on the same WiFi could read it.

I get some people don't realize that's how TCP/IP works and the firesheep stuff all happened 15 years ago. But a bit worrying to see a frequent HN contributor challenging that.

That's why we now push for Https everywhere.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It's malicious intent! The developer isn't a kid, they're releasing the software for world wide use. It's a simple thing, do not send private data to remote servers without explicitly asking the user!

In your eyes maybe (and mine for the record), but different people have different values and expectations of what is privacy.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's malicious intent! The developer isn't a kid, they're releasing the software for world wide use. It's a simple thing, do not send private data to remote servers without explicitly asking the user!

In your eyes maybe (and mine for the record), but different people have different values and expectations of what is privacy.

If that was an acceptable response we shouldn't accept people from those cultures into positions where they can affect our privacy. Or we can just stop using "cultural differences" as a bludgeon to whitewash bad behavior.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#64

> Part of the justification for moving to Wayland over X11 is to make security vulnerabilities relating to one application spying on another more difficult to introduce. Yea, because, how else am I going to run shady poorly maintained dictionary software that ignores system settings from a hostile country? What kind of world are we living in with X11?! The software could just as well hook into your downloads folder a…

You basically need to call a vote or ask the tech committee to rule otherwise if the maintainer says it's fine.

It's not really a bug if it's an advertised feature you don't like, so security team cannot do much in theory.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#65
post #37

it looks like a serious "privacy violation" for English-only users. But for many ESL or non-English users out there, the "translation" is a must. On Windoes, I remember some translation programs go extreme, they hijack all GDI calls and scan for all strings on GUIs trying to translate and replace them inline. Local dictionary were pretty limited so many of them use online services. What happens when user input someth…

Translation isn't the problem, sending data over the network by default is. Data is leaked to Chinese dictionary servers even if you're translating between European languages using a local language according to https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=806960.

With the GDI hijacking programs you usually download them for specific languages with the knowledge they're internet connected.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#66
>This would normally not be much cause for concern; of course a dictionary program will include code to talk to dictionary-providing web sites.

Hey, an area I finally know something about. It depends on what you're trying to do.

The slimmed down version of a Finnish dictionary I provide in `tsk` [1] weighs in at around 30 MB, for about 250,000 Finnish words. It's small enough that I embed the whole dictionary directly into the binary and reconstruct the prefix search on the fly every time the user starts the app.

However, the much larger database which contains things like lemmatization and etymology information easily balloons up to many, many gigabytes in size. My problem domain is providing Truly Instant Lookup, keystroke by keystroke, so I can't really get around this level of memoization. The work to figure all this out was sufficient that I decided to make future versions a paid product instead [2].

Most other use cases would just call out to a server, because it's silly to think most people are going to download a giant database for that use case alone. A hybrid approach could also make a lot of sense, eg cache the most common 10,000 words locally and call out for the next 1.5 million, which are statistically extremely rare.

[1]: https://github.com/hiandrewquinn/tsk

[2]: https://taskusanakirja.com/ (offline for now until I get Digicert to certify my downloads wholesome for Windows resale)

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#67

While I have a lot of respect for the effort that goes into Debian, I always disliked this kind of "maximalism" from the package manager. Oh, the user wants "foo"? Let's install every software that might be even remotely useful somehow in combination with foo! Oh there is a network daemon in there? Fantastic, let's start it immediately! I know that there is a flag to disable the installation for "recommended" package…

The other extreme where you are missing expected functionality because it's optional isn't any better. The problem is not that recommended dependencies are installed by default, it's that package recommendations should perhaps be more conservative. Note that Debian already differentiates between recommended dependencies (which most users should want) and suggested dependencies (related functionality or enhancements that are not relevant for every user).

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#68

> Part of the justification for moving to Wayland over X11 is to make security vulnerabilities relating to one application spying on another more difficult to introduce. Yea, because, how else am I going to run shady poorly maintained dictionary software that ignores system settings from a hostile country? What kind of world are we living in with X11?! The software could just as well hook into your downloads folder a…

>The software could just as well hook into your downloads folder

correct which is why wayland is only one piece in improving security, you still need proper sandboxing

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are cherry picking. The next statement says that the scan feature doesn't even work on wayland. Lol. That's worse than working + buggy. (security bugs are just bugs. Nothing special about them) > That does mean that it breaks StarDict's scan feature, though.

No, Wayland is clearly better here. Not allowing an app to do a potentially stupid privacy compromising thing is better that allowing it by default and providing no way to block it. Better does not necessarily mean good though, that Mac approach of block by default but allow users to enable these things for specific apps on settings would be a great improvement.

The privacy compromising part is _not_ in the 'reading selection' part. It is in the part where it sends it over http to dict.cn. The solution is therefore, obviously, to replace dict.cn with an offline dictionary. Not what wayland does, which is blocking reading selections in the first place. That is brain damaged.

In the X11 case, I can uninstall the app and install one that uses an offline dictionary and gives me a scan feature. That very much is a way to "block" it. Wanting a scan feature is not wrong. It's my computer. I want it. In the Wayland case, I cannot do _anything_ about it. The X11 situation is thus obviously better.

It's not like "define current selection" is some niche feature either. It's a default feature in macOs, iOS and Android.

You either do it the macos way or the windows/x11 way. You cannot half-ass something in between. That is just security theatre and is utterly retarded. Every wayland release until it makes a macos-style permission system (I dont care whether the default is accept or deny) is pure cancer. And every distro/DE that pushes wayland onto you until that point is also cancer.

Re: StarDict sends X11 clipboard to remote servers

#70

While I have a lot of respect for the effort that goes into Debian, I always disliked this kind of "maximalism" from the package manager. Oh, the user wants "foo"? Let's install every software that might be even remotely useful somehow in combination with foo! Oh there is a network daemon in there? Fantastic, let's start it immediately! I know that there is a flag to disable the installation for "recommended" package…

I'll politely disagree. First of all, "Recommends" is reserved for packages which enhance the functionality of the package you're installing. Without these the package will not break, but some very useful functionality might be disabled. The package-class you're talking about is "suggests", IOW, "these packages might also be useful for you, wanna look?" section. These are not installed by default already. On the othe…

I agree that recommends makes sense but this is a bullshit argument:

> On the other hand, apt and aptitude provides previews before doing something. You don't have to accept them. In aptitude's case, you can fine tune before the final commit, even.

You can't expect the average user to understand the entire dependency tree and read the description of dozens of random packages that the average program pulls in. RTFM is not a valid excuse for bad defaults.

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