Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants • Hacker News Board

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#61

Post by aborsy » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:31 AM UTC

noelwelsh wrote: post #47

m101 wrote: post #13

UCLA has an endowment of 3.8bn$. Whilst I'm sympathetic to their desire to be further government financed for the work they do, I feel like government financing should be made available to those that actually need the money. The attitude that you have access to government funds even if you have the ability to pay yourself needs to change.

Governments typically fund research because 1) it's seen as beneficial for the country, and hence falls under the remit of governments in democratic countries and 2) the uncertainty, time frame, or lack of direct commercialization of research typically means the private sector will not invest in it. Your suggestion is saying that research should be privatised, and shows very little thought about how research works an…

Research 50 years ago, sure. Research now is very different. It’s short term, chasing money, trends, citations, prestige, hierarchy, academic power, and applications. Public should fund only the useful part of it.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#62

Post by eterm » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:31 AM UTC

exe34 wrote: post #9

padjo wrote: post #5

It’s pretty clear that the only numbers this administration are interested in are ones that support the narrative that the great leader is infallible.

They just fired the commissioner of Labour Statistics. The great thing about autocrats is that they neuter their own country pretty quickly. When you make it risky for people to give you bad news, you end up with missiles that don't work and capital ships that sink.

That may be a comforting thought, but the reality is that it takes decades for these things to have an effect, and there's no guarantee that transitioning to a low trust and high corruption society will result in the removal of the autocrat.

See North Korea or Russia. People have been claiming they're on the verge of collapse for decades but the reality is that they just keep going.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#63

Post by bsaul » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:32 AM UTC

kzrdude wrote: post #25

ekianjo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thats why they should refrain from engaging in politics in the first place. the day the wind changes you lose.

Then it's maybe not a free country anymore if you have to think about how your actions are perceived by the president in power at every step.

i agree with you, but i think it's been the case in the US for the past 15 years already. The only difference is trump pushing toward different issues than biden.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#64

Post by delusional » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:32 AM UTC

numbers_guy wrote: post #43

francasso wrote: post #31

Maybe it's time to move to Europe or China

There is nowhere to run and hide. Europe is worse than the US on this front. China also demands party loyalty. In a sense this is just the human condition. The ruling faction demands loyalty. Only a very advanced human civilization could move past that and allow criticism of the ruling class. Maybe the US had achieved that for a brief movement in the past or maybe it was just an illusion. EDIT: For people wondering w…

What are you on about? I live in Europe. We don't terminate all contact to random universities because they said something the führer didn't like.

If you truly believe that the whole world is "just as bad" as this, then you are unimaginably far to the right.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#65

Post by hcknwscommenter » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:32 AM UTC

roenxi wrote: post #16

exe34 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They just fired the commissioner of Labour Statistics. The great thing about autocrats is that they neuter their own country pretty quickly. When you make it risky for people to give you bad news, you end up with missiles that don't work and capital ships that sink.

The US BLS does seem to have a bit of a history [0] with their job reporting though. The process they've been using appears biased to over report initially and then get revised down over time. I'm sure there are a lot of political considerations, but from a raw statistical perspective there is a pretty easy path to getting better results. They could eliminate the optimistic bias and aim for accuracy. If it were me I'…

The source you cite is written by a man with literally zero training in economics or econometrics. He lost his job in 911 and started a blog in the GFC that gained an audience (https://mishtalk.com/economics/uk-high-school-student-asks-m...). Good for him. You assert with absolutely no basis in fact or any supporting citation that "there is a pretty easy path to getting better results." The BLS is run by the world's experts in how to measure what they are measuring. The private payroll company ADP reports their own numbers and has never demonstrated better accuracy despite the huge profit motive they have there. If it's so easy, then why don't you just write out a detailed explanation of how this supposed bias happens and how to fix it. You can't because it's not true that there is this sort of bias or that there is an easy fix (revisions are sometimes up and sometimes down, early data is not as reliable as later data). The BLS is constantly at work developing and testing new ways of doing their job better faster and cheaper. It's a difficult job done by thoughtful people. Bloomberg had a very contentious interview today with Peter Navarro and basically called him and Trump a liar over this made up allegation of political bias and/or incompetence at the BLS ("we just don't have evidence to support those instances here at Bloomberg"). This was the biggest miss in 50 years, yes. However, that's ignoring the fact that the economy is very much larger now and looking at the miss in terms of absolute job numbers revised is dumb, and the tariff uncertainty/TACO trade/Fed bullying/debt ceiling/and big beautiful bill drama is making this a particularly difficult time for this type of forecast.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#66

Post by tsm » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:32 AM UTC

numbers_guy wrote: post #43

francasso wrote: post #31

Maybe it's time to move to Europe or China

There is nowhere to run and hide. Europe is worse than the US on this front. China also demands party loyalty. In a sense this is just the human condition. The ruling faction demands loyalty. Only a very advanced human civilization could move past that and allow criticism of the ruling class. Maybe the US had achieved that for a brief movement in the past or maybe it was just an illusion. EDIT: For people wondering w…

>Europe is worse than the US on this front

Would you please expand on this?

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#67

Post by xdennis » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:34 AM UTC

bigDinosaur wrote: post #17

m101 wrote: post #13

UCLA has an endowment of 3.8bn$. Whilst I'm sympathetic to their desire to be further government financed for the work they do, I feel like government financing should be made available to those that actually need the money. The attitude that you have access to government funds even if you have the ability to pay yourself needs to change.

Endowments are often earmarked for certain use cases. They aren't necessarily permitted to spend it as they like.

Maybe taxes should be the same. I don't mind being taxed as much as I hate my taxes going to the wrong thing.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#68

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:34 AM UTC

trhway wrote: post #59

raincole wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-07-29/ucla-set... > The lawsuit, filed more than a year ago, alleged that by not immediately ordering the encampment to be taken down, UCLA provided support to pro-Palestinian activists who “enforced” what it termed a “Jew Exclusion Zone,” prohibiting Jewish students and staff from passing through the camp’s makeshift barricades. Personally I think this is a textbook raci…

>pro-Palestinian activists who “enforced” what it termed a “Jew Exclusion Zone,” prohibiting Jewish students and staff from passing through the camp’s makeshift barricades. for me it looks like not just a civil case with UCLA. To me it looks like a straight criminal case of violation of federal civil rights law that FBI is supposed to prosecute. I.e. instead of collective punishment for the whole UCLA, i'd go with cr…

[deleted]

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#69

Post by davrosthedalek » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:35 AM UTC

lordofgibbons wrote: post #56

raincole wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2025-07-29/ucla-set... > The lawsuit, filed more than a year ago, alleged that by not immediately ordering the encampment to be taken down, UCLA provided support to pro-Palestinian activists who “enforced” what it termed a “Jew Exclusion Zone,” prohibiting Jewish students and staff from passing through the camp’s makeshift barricades. Personally I think this is a textbook raci…

You can term anything whatever you want, doesn't make it true. The "Jew Exclusion Zone" term was coined by the plaintiff in this case. A lot of the college protesters are in fact Jewish. This is a fact the pro-Israel propaganda would rather you not know about. Otherwise, how could they claim "antisemitism" whenever you criticize the actions of the foreign country.

To add some more anec-data: I have a couple of Jewish colleagues. Several of them received death threats. This is not acceptable.

Re: Terence Tao on the suspension of UCLA grants

#70

Post by bryanrasmussen » Sat, Aug 02, 2025, 9:35 AM UTC

m101 wrote: post #13

UCLA has an endowment of 3.8bn$. Whilst I'm sympathetic to their desire to be further government financed for the work they do, I feel like government financing should be made available to those that actually need the money. The attitude that you have access to government funds even if you have the ability to pay yourself needs to change.

>UCLA has an endowment of 3.8bn$

you say that like it's a lot of money? I mean sure, in comparison to the amount of money I make yes, but in comparison to value derived from research, amounts of money collected from California, amount of money given to California, and amount of money federal government spends on other things - is it a lot of money? I have a feeling it's not.

>I feel like government financing should be made available to those that actually need the money.

yeah, if they actually needed the money they would shut down the programs using the money when they stopped getting the money.