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Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

arstechnica.com

61–70 of 145 posts

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#61

If Waymo has taught me anything, it’s that people will eventually accept robotic surgeons. It won’t happen overnight but once the data shows overwhelming superiority, it’ll be adopted.

There’s been superiority with computer vision over radiologists for >10 years and still we wait

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#62

If Waymo has taught me anything, it’s that people will eventually accept robotic surgeons. It won’t happen overnight but once the data shows overwhelming superiority, it’ll be adopted.

I think Waymo is a little bit different and driving in general. Because you have an activity that most people don’t trust how other people perform it already. It’s easier to accept the robo driver.

For the medical world, I’d look to the Invisalign example as a more realistic path on how automation will become part of it.

The human will still be there the scale of operations per doctor will go up and prices will go down.

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#63
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, if there's overwhelming superiority, why not? But a lot of surgeries are special corner cases. How do you train for those?

Who do you think has seen more corner cases? A) All the DaVinci robots that have ever been used for a particular type of surgery. B) The most experienced surgeon of that specialty.

The most experienced surgeon bc the robots are only given cases that fit within their rubric of use cases and the people handle edge cases

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#64
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why?

Because a LLM architecture seems way too fuzzy and unpredictable for something that should be reproducible.

Real world isn't "reproducible". If a robot can't handle weird and unexpected failures, it wouldn't survive out there.

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who do you think has seen more corner cases? A) All the DaVinci robots that have ever been used for a particular type of surgery. B) The most experienced surgeon of that specialty.

The most experienced surgeon bc the robots are only given cases that fit within their rubric of use cases and the people handle edge cases

Incorrect.

DaVinci robots are operated by surgeons themselves, using electronic controls.

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#66

If Waymo has taught me anything, it’s that people will eventually accept robotic surgeons. It won’t happen overnight but once the data shows overwhelming superiority, it’ll be adopted.

waymo only needs to operate in a 2D space and care about what's in front and on the sides of it.

that's much simpler than three dimensional coordination.

an "oops" in a car is not immediately life threatening either

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#67
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The skill of these only improve Citation effing needed. It's taken as an axiom that these systems will keep on improving, even though there's no indication that this is the case.

[flagged]

I'd recommend reviewing the site guidelines. HN strives for more courteous discussions than you seem to embrace.

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#68
post #62

If Waymo has taught me anything, it’s that people will eventually accept robotic surgeons. It won’t happen overnight but once the data shows overwhelming superiority, it’ll be adopted.

I think Waymo is a little bit different and driving in general. Because you have an activity that most people don’t trust how other people perform it already. It’s easier to accept the robo driver. For the medical world, I’d look to the Invisalign example as a more realistic path on how automation will become part of it. The human will still be there the scale of operations per doctor will go up and prices will go do…

Uhmmm... I'm sorry but when Waymo started near everyone I talked to about it says "zero % I'm going in one of those things, they won't be allowed anyway, they'll never be better than a human, I wouldn't trust one, nope, no way" and now people can't wait to try them. I understand what you're saying about the trusted side of the house (surgeons are generally high trust) - but I do think OP is right, once the data is in, people will want robot surgery.

Re: Experimental surgery performed by AI-driven surgical robot

#69
post #68
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Waymo is a little bit different and driving in general. Because you have an activity that most people don’t trust how other people perform it already. It’s easier to accept the robo driver. For the medical world, I’d look to the Invisalign example as a more realistic path on how automation will become part of it. The human will still be there the scale of operations per doctor will go up and prices will go do…

Uhmmm... I'm sorry but when Waymo started near everyone I talked to about it says "zero % I'm going in one of those things, they won't be allowed anyway, they'll never be better than a human, I wouldn't trust one, nope, no way" and now people can't wait to try them. I understand what you're saying about the trusted side of the house (surgeons are generally high trust) - but I do think OP is right, once the data is in…

Of course they will. I don’t argue that they won’t.

I just say that the path to that and the way it’s going to be implemented is going to be different and Invisalign is a better example to how it will happen in the medical industry compared to automotive.

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