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National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

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Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#61

Post by [deleted] »

vkou wrote: post #45
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the sort of bureaucratic nonsense people actually rail against. You're assuming you'd get something truthful or informative out of that process, when in reality you'll get the opposite due to the inherit (dis)incentives.

Right, I guess we should throw up our hands and let the dictator of the week run things as he sees, with no oversight. If it meaningfully impacts the public, the public should have input. The input doesn't need to be binding, but it needs to be taken into consideration. Representative government is not a once-every-four-years exercise, nor is it something that should only be accessible to the mega-rich. There's an en…

[deleted]

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#62

Post by thadt »

londons_explore wrote: post #57
Molitor5901 wrote: post #46

I have a researcher card, it's not an arduous process. The staff are very kind. When you show up to the National Archives in Washington, DC., prepare to encounter a general group of 2 dozen pros carrying scanners, laptops, etc. It's quite the experience. I don't see this is that big of a deal. It's open, you can access it, but they are controlling more. Given the propensity for the theft and destruction of archives d…

I want more lockdown of the original documents (put them in a cave somewhere), but more openness of digital scans. Please just make a huge torrent and let everyone take a look.

There are a significant number of digital scans available online. The problem is that they're only a tip of the iceberg of the available material, and digitizing records costs time and money (that apparently they don't have much of right now).

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#63

Post by ajdlinux »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #59
Molitor5901 wrote: post #46

I have a researcher card, it's not an arduous process. The staff are very kind. When you show up to the National Archives in Washington, DC., prepare to encounter a general group of 2 dozen pros carrying scanners, laptops, etc. It's quite the experience. I don't see this is that big of a deal. It's open, you can access it, but they are controlling more. Given the propensity for the theft and destruction of archives d…

Do they actually bring out unique archival records for the general public? I thought it was always backed up stuff. If not, even assuming a 0.1% rate of scroundels over time that must mean thousands of records have been destroyed or stolen or tampered with…

Can't speak for the US National Archives, but I do occasionally head to the National Archives of Australia to look at things that pique my interest, and I can confirm that yes, you can just ask for entire folders full of documents and in most cases, they'll take the originals and just plop them in a plastic tub for you to pick up and have a read through. It is a slightly strange feeling opening up a file and flicking through correspondence that was once personally handled by a Prime Minister from 100+ years ago. (They will use scanned copies for anything that either can't be handled for conservation reasons or has been redacted for security reasons.)

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#64

Post by lIl-IIIl »

IvyMike wrote: post #30

From the site: > All researchers must apply and present a researcher card, which may be obtained in Room 1000. This ensures that proper identification is on file for all individuals accessing the building to establish a legitimate business purpose. Abuse of any researcher registration to circumvent access by the general public may result in a trespass situation and a permanent ban from access to all NARA facilities.…

The actual process of getting a research card does not mention any business need. It just asks to show ID and watch a training video:https://www.archives.gov/research/start/researcher-card. It specifically mentions student IDs.

But maybe that page is not updated yet with new policy.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#66

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

vkou wrote: post #45
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the sort of bureaucratic nonsense people actually rail against. You're assuming you'd get something truthful or informative out of that process, when in reality you'll get the opposite due to the inherit (dis)incentives.

Right, I guess we should throw up our hands and let the dictator of the week run things as he sees, with no oversight. If it meaningfully impacts the public, the public should have input. The input doesn't need to be binding, but it needs to be taken into consideration. Representative government is not a once-every-four-years exercise, nor is it something that should only be accessible to the mega-rich. There's an en…

there's no oversight needed when the government does a lot less

If there's no loose budget, there's far fewer things that go into the black budgets.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#68

Post by strangattractor »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #21
treetalker wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abandon all hope, ye who seek reflective reasoning from this government. But my guess is that less public access to national information helps, and does not hinder, a speed-run to autocracy.

I dunno. I'm very much not a Trump fan, but I don't see how restricting access to "national information" would help him. And if it would, how does restricting access to one of them help him? I could more see this as being just random action without any real purpose, or aimed at petty revenge on someone, or something.

I can see situations where there maybe someone considered a "Left" leaning PhD researcher may have access revoked due to lack of "business purposes". Can't have those pesky progressives looking up inconvenient facts.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#69

Post by jonstewart »

IvyMike wrote: post #30

From the site: > All researchers must apply and present a researcher card, which may be obtained in Room 1000. This ensures that proper identification is on file for all individuals accessing the building to establish a legitimate business purpose. Abuse of any researcher registration to circumvent access by the general public may result in a trespass situation and a permanent ban from access to all NARA facilities.…

It means if you are a crazy person, you can no longer waltz in off your motorcycle and demand all documents related to alien spacecraft held at Area 51 or the real unedited Zapruder film that clearly shows Walt Disney was the triggerman, etc.

My guess is anyone could still pursue whatever crazy theories they wanted, so long as they conducted their research legitimately, i.e., as a legitimate _process_ of research, with no value judgment on the topic or end goal.

Re: National Archives at College Park, MD, will become a restricted federal facility

#70

Post by samus »

LastTrain wrote: post #24
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno. I'm very much not a Trump fan, but I don't see how restricting access to "national information" would help him. And if it would, how does restricting access to one of them help him? I could more see this as being just random action without any real purpose, or aimed at petty revenge on someone, or something.

Everything they do is meant to sew mistrust. It doesn’t need to have any other benefit. I don’t think they are trying to hide anything, and I don’t think this is about staffing - they just want to wreck government and your trust in it.

You're assuming competence. They are simply not giving a flying s**t about many things, break stuff and cause chaos somewhere else (Chesterton's Fence applies), cut funding, and affected agencies now have to deal with it.
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