Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 448 posts

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#61

Post by ajsnigrutin »

fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #57
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are not 20 something college students with jobs and rented apartments, doing stuff without their parents knowing. These are kids younger than 13, they don't have jobs, they live with their parents, no internet/data planes outside of control of their parents, no nothing. The goal of these laws is to get ID checks on social networks for everyone, so the governments know who the "loud ones" (against whatever polit…

It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children. "Maintain the status quo" isn't an attractive response to that. ID laws are not a perfect solution, maybe not even a good one. You undermine your whole point by pretending VPNs are going to make the whole thing moot. Why do you care when you won't be affected because you can just use a VPN? Why does pornhub make su…

ID laws are the end goal, the children and porn are just an excuse to get ID laws, which would give the governments a lot more control over the internet and social networks. Just imagin someone like Trump/Ursula requesting full list of names of everyone criticizing them on eg reddit (because reddit has porn, and you'd have to show your ID to be able to use reddit, because of your reasons). This is objectively bad for the people and for the internet.

Parenting is a good solution, not just giving the kids tablets so they stay quiet. Yes, kids are curious, kids will still find porn, ID laws or not, but parents should teach them and limit their access, not IDs on discord.

And of course porhub is making a fuss, are you, an (assuming an) adult going to go to your telco with your ID and say "hi, i'm John, i want to watch porn and jerk off, but you need to see my ID first"? Or will you find some other alternatives, where pornhub doesn't earn that money?

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#62

Post by woodrowbarlow »

like_any_other wrote: post #53
woodrowbarlow wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ultimately, i think the endgame is to require government ID in order to access internet services in general, a la ender's game.

Many countries (including in the EU) already required ID to use a SIM card: https://forestvpn.com/blog/news/countries-sim-card-registrat... Funnily enough, when the Philippines did this, it was decried as a violation of human rights [1]. But usually, media are so silent on such things I'd call them complicit. One already cannot so much as rent a hotel room anywhere in the EU without showing government ID. [1] https:/…

yup, and this gives the ability to look up per-citizen location data.

sidebar: i've been trying to raise awareness about "joint communications and sensing" wherever i can lately; many companies involved in 6G standardization (esp. nokia) want the 6G network to use mmWave radio to create realtime 3d environment mappings, aka a "digital twin" of the physical world, aka a surveillance state's wet dream.

https://www.nokia.com/blog/building-a-network-with-a-sixth-s...

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#63

Post by 1659447091 »

zevv wrote: post #12

So, what will be the proper technology to apply here? I have no problem with verification of my age (not the date of birth, just the boolean, >18yo), but I do have a problem with sending any party a picture of my face or my passport.

OIDC4VCI(OpenID for Verifiable Credential Issuance)[0] is what I think has the most promise.

My understanding is that an issuer can issue a Credential that asserts the claims (eg, you are over 18) that you make to another entity/website and that entity can verify those claims you present to them (Verifiable Credentials).

For example, if we can get banks - who already know our full identity - to become Credential Issuers, then we can use bank provided Credentials (that assert we are over 18) to present to websites and services that require age verification WITHOUT having to give them all of our personal information. As long the site or service trust that Issuer.

[0] https://openid.net/specs/openid-4-verifiable-credential-issu...

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#64

Post by mezzie2 »

nemomarx wrote: post #18
mezzie2 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not even edge cases - I was a pretty young looking woman and was mistaken for a minor until I was about 24-25. My mother had her first child (me) at 27 and tells me about how she and my father would get dirty looks because they assumed he was some dirty old man that had impregnated a teenager. (He was 3 years older than her). I think, ironically, the best way to fight this would be to lean on identity politics:…

I don't think they make much of a show of caring about trans rights in the UK right about now, unfortunately. In the US you can make a strong case that a big database of faces and IDs could be really dangerous though I think

It's mostly about the service's audience. Discord is a huge trans/queer/etc. hub. If Discord were X or Instagram etc. it wouldn't matter. Users of Discord are, as a group, more likely to be antagonistic to anything that could be transphobic or racist than the general populace. (Whereas they don't care about disability rights, which is why people with medically delayed puberty aren't a concern.)

A tactical observation more than anything else.

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#65

Post by nemomarx »

tbrownaw wrote: post #54
nemomarx wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they make much of a show of caring about trans rights in the UK right about now, unfortunately. In the US you can make a strong case that a big database of faces and IDs could be really dangerous though I think

> In the US you can make a strong case that a big database of faces and IDs could be really dangerous though I think The government already has this from RealID.

Right but only your photo taken for the Id, not up to date face scans that discord is requesting

it seems to me like I'd be more hesitant to go get a govt photo taken right now at least.

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#66

Post by Hizonner »

1659447091 wrote: post #63
zevv wrote: post #12

So, what will be the proper technology to apply here? I have no problem with verification of my age (not the date of birth, just the boolean, >18yo), but I do have a problem with sending any party a picture of my face or my passport.

OIDC4VCI(OpenID for Verifiable Credential Issuance)[0] is what I think has the most promise. My understanding is that an issuer can issue a Credential that asserts the claims (eg, you are over 18) that you make to another entity/website and that entity can verify those claims you present to them (Verifiable Credentials). For example, if we can get banks - who already know our full identity - to become Credential Issu…

You mean without giving them any personal information other than where to find your bank account.

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#67

Post by Hizonner »

fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #57
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are not 20 something college students with jobs and rented apartments, doing stuff without their parents knowing. These are kids younger than 13, they don't have jobs, they live with their parents, no internet/data planes outside of control of their parents, no nothing. The goal of these laws is to get ID checks on social networks for everyone, so the governments know who the "loud ones" (against whatever polit…

It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children. "Maintain the status quo" isn't an attractive response to that. ID laws are not a perfect solution, maybe not even a good one. You undermine your whole point by pretending VPNs are going to make the whole thing moot. Why do you care when you won't be affected because you can just use a VPN? Why does pornhub make su…

> It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children.

It only "has to be acknowledged" if it's true. The "evidence" for either of those, but especially social media (as if that were even a single well defined thing to begin with) is pretty damned shakey. Nobody "has to acknowledge" your personal prejudices.

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#69

Post by fkyoureadthedoc »

Hizonner wrote: post #67
fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children. "Maintain the status quo" isn't an attractive response to that. ID laws are not a perfect solution, maybe not even a good one. You undermine your whole point by pretending VPNs are going to make the whole thing moot. Why do you care when you won't be affected because you can just use a VPN? Why does pornhub make su…

> It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children. It only "has to be acknowledged" if it's true. The "evidence" for either of those, but especially social media (as if that were even a single well defined thing to begin with) is pretty damned shakey. Nobody "has to acknowledge" your personal prejudices.

You've convinced me that pornography is, in fact, beneficial to children. What was I thinking? Thank you for your reply.

Re: Discord's face scanning age checks 'start of a bigger shift'

#70

Post by fkyoureadthedoc »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #61
fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has to be acknowledged that some things, like social media and pornography, are harmful to children. "Maintain the status quo" isn't an attractive response to that. ID laws are not a perfect solution, maybe not even a good one. You undermine your whole point by pretending VPNs are going to make the whole thing moot. Why do you care when you won't be affected because you can just use a VPN? Why does pornhub make su…

ID laws are the end goal, the children and porn are just an excuse to get ID laws, which would give the governments a lot more control over the internet and social networks. Just imagin someone like Trump/Ursula requesting full list of names of everyone criticizing them on eg reddit (because reddit has porn, and you'd have to show your ID to be able to use reddit, because of your reasons). This is objectively bad for…

> Parenting is a good solution

Yes, to most of society's problems. Yet they persist.

Post reply on HN