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OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

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61–70 of 527 posts

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#61
post #19

Is there a non-obvious reason using something like Python to solve queries requiring calculations was not used from day one with LLMs?

Because it‘s not a feature of the LLM but the product that is built around it (like ChatGPT).

It's true that product provides the tools, but the model still needs to be trained to use tools, or it won't use them well or at the right times.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#62
I have doubts whether the live stream was really live.

During the live-stream the subtitles are shown line by line.

When subtitles are auto-generated, they pop up word by word, which I assume would need to happen during a real live stream.

Line-by-line subtitles are shown if the uploader provides captions by themselves for an existing video, the only way OpenAI could provide captions ahead of time, is if the "live-stream" isn't actually live.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#63

Very impressive! But under arguably the most important benchmark -- SWE-bench verified for real-world coding tasks -- Claude 3.7 still remains the champion.[1] Incredible how resilient Claude models have been for best-in-coding class. [1] But by only about 1%, and inclusive of Claude's "custom scaffold" augmentation (which in practice I assume almost no one uses?). The new OpenAI models might still be effectively bes…

Gemini 2.5 Pro is widely considered superior to 3.7 Sonnet now by heavy users, but they don't have an SWE-bench score. Shows that looking at one such benchmark isn't very telling. Main advantage over Sonnet being that it's better at using a large amount of context, which is enormously helpful during coding tasks.

Sonnet is still an incredibly impressive model as it held the crown for 6 months, which may as well be a decade with the current pace of LLM improvement.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#64

Maybe OpenAI needs an easy mode for all these people saying 5 choices of models (and that's only if you pay) is simply too confusing for them. They even provide a description in the UI of each before you select it, and it defaults to a model for you. If you just want an answer of what you should use and can't be bothered to research them, just use o3(4)-mini and call it a day.

I personally like being able to choose because I understand the tradeoffs and want to choose the best one for what I’m asking. So I hope this doesn’t go away.

But I agree that they probably need some kind of basic mode to make things easier for the average person. The basic mode should decide automatically what model to use and hide this from the user.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#65
post #6

The pace of notable releases across the industry right now is unlike any time I remember since I started doing this in the early 2000's. And it feels like it's accelerating

Not really. We’re definitely in the incremental improvement stage at this point. Certainly no indication that progress is “accelerating”.

ChatGPT 3 : iPhone 1

A bunch of models later, we're about on the iPhone 4-5 now. Feels about right.

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#66

ChatGPT Plus, Pro, and Team users will see o3, o4-mini, and o4-mini-high in the model selector starting today, replacing o1, o3‑mini, and o3‑mini‑high. I subscribe to pro but don't yet see the new models (either in the Android app or on the web version).

Same...

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#67
post #33
post #14

What is wrong with OpenAI? The naming of their models seems like it is intentionally confusing - maybe to distract from lack of progress? Honestly, I have no idea which model to use for simply everyday tasks anymore.

Seems to me like they're somewhat trying to simplify now. GPT-N.m -> Non-reasoning oN -> Reasoning oN+1-mini -> Reasoning but speedy; cut-down version of an upcoming oN model (unclear if true or marketing) It would be nice if they actually stick to this pattern.

I suspect that "ChatGPT-4o" is the most confusing part. Absolutely baffling to go with that and then later "oN", but surely they will avoid any "No" models moving forward

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#68
A very subtle mention of o3-pro, which I'd imagine is now the most capable programming model. Excited to see when I get access to that.

Good thing I stopped working a few hours ago

EDIT: Altman tweeted o3-pro is coming out in a few weeks, looks like that guy misspoke :(

Re: OpenAI o3 and o4-mini

#70

I have doubts whether the live stream was really live. During the live-stream the subtitles are shown line by line. When subtitles are auto-generated, they pop up word by word, which I assume would need to happen during a real live stream. Line-by-line subtitles are shown if the uploader provides captions by themselves for an existing video, the only way OpenAI could provide captions ahead of time, is if the "live-st…

I think this is just a quirk of how Google does live captions.
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