Live data from Hacker News

Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

deno.com

61–70 of 201 posts

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#61
post #22

Calling EMCAScript JavaScript was a huge mistake that is still biting us.

That's anachronistic: it was called JavaScript long before the ECMA specification and the ECMAScript name appeared. That the JavaScript name is dumb is pretty much universally agreed on.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#62
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Believe it or not IE was still supported in some capacity until 2022, and the underlying Trident engine is still supported until at least 2029. Edge has an official "IE Mode" which switches the backend from Chromium to Trident, effectively turning it into IE with a modern skin. Microsoft support lifecycles are no joke.

>Microsoft support lifecycles are no joke. Except for Mail and Calendar that they randomly decided to murder and replace with some Outlook webapp garbage.

For business plans the old Outlook is still supported until "at least 2029" [1]. That's four more years to switch. And Microsoft hasn't even committed to stopping support at that date, they just don't want to promise more. I fully expect them to extend it because some large customers won't have switched.

What is unusual is how pushy Microsoft is in trying to get people to switch now instead of in the last second. And of course the quick murder of the consumer email thingy

[1] https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/blog/outlook/new-outlook...

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#64
Just under 30 years ago, when I was starting my IT studies, I had an older colleague who was a great authority to me. When I began learning about RDBMS options, I called him to ask, „What do you think about Oracle?”. He just shouted, „Total crap!!!” and that was enough for me. Since then, to this day, I’ve never touched Oracle.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#65
post #13
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't say 2019 is particularly old. I didn't even know IE still existed at the time - I thought it had been replaced by Edge.

Believe it or not IE was still supported in some capacity until 2022, and the underlying Trident engine is still supported until at least 2029. Edge has an official "IE Mode" which switches the backend from Chromium to Trident, effectively turning it into IE with a modern skin. Microsoft support lifecycles are no joke.

which switches the backend from Chromium to Trident, effectively turning it into IE with a modern skin

I wish they'd done the opposite instead: same UI, but with a better browser engine.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#66

I hope this is good marketing for Deno and not just a huge distraction. I feel like Bun is running circles around them right now. I feel like there might even be room for 3 winners (Bun, Deno, Node) but I don't understand the point of this. If Deno wins this battle will that make we want use Deno more?

I think it's a passion project for the founder, who built his career on JS and is offended that Oracle (a company famous for deploying lawyers instead of technological expertise) claims to control it.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#67

Hear me out: the web / oss community could absolutely band together and rebrand JavaScript. Could be: LiveScript, WebScript, etc. There would be good support and we could do it fairly swiftly. To hell with Oracle.

I like NetScript, give a little callback to Netscape.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#68
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea their CLI has 510 Weekly Downloads on npm and JET itself nearly 1000. https://www.npmjs.com/package/@oracle/ojet-cli https://www.npmjs.com/package/@oracle/oraclejet

A date picker widget I tossed on NPM 13 years ago gets 32,000 downloads per week. 510 a week is background activity, that's indexing bots or one org's CI system.

I totally agree. I thought about adding a paragraph about how it seems like even oracle themself doesn’t use it on production (cause otherwise it’d have probably more downloads due to developers, CI, you name it) but it is possible they use a internal npm proxy with a cache. Anyway it’s laughable that this package is the reason they base their argument on.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#69
post #51

They are using the wrong tactics. They should use the "Kleenex" argument and say it's generic. But what do I know.

But they are… genericness is a key part of their argument.

>Our petition challenges Oracle’s trademark on three grounds:

>Genericness – JavaScript is a widely used programming language, not an Oracle product.

>Abandonment – Oracle does not control, maintain, or enforce the trademark.

>Fraud on the USPTO – Oracle submitted misleading evidence in its renewal filing.

Re: Oracle justified its JavaScript trademark with Node.js–now it wants that ignored

#70
post #64

Just under 30 years ago, when I was starting my IT studies, I had an older colleague who was a great authority to me. When I began learning about RDBMS options, I called him to ask, „What do you think about Oracle?”. He just shouted, „Total crap!!!” and that was enough for me. Since then, to this day, I’ve never touched Oracle.

I don't think it's necessarily fair to say Oracle is total crap. For decades they were more performant and had more features than most anything else on the market. They supported scale-out clustering on linux with Oracle RAC. They were early adopters of high performance NFS moving the NFS stack out of the linux kernel and directly into the database with DirectNFS. They built a clustered filesystem for block-based clusters (OCFS).

HOWEVER, the way they run their business is horrible. Oracle the product was various versions of awesome to just OK. Oracle the business is a modern-day mafioso shakedown.

Post reply on HN