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No Billionares at FOSDEM

drewdevault.com

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Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#61

Post by throw5959 »

ImPostingOnHN wrote: post #46
throw5959 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What other person started a rocket company from scratch and got them landing? Of course I want to hear everything he says. Yes, he's crazy - seems to be a requirement if you want to do such stuff. Doesn't mean I will ignore it. I can think for myself, it's not like I take everything at face value. All that to say, perhaps other people don't prioritize values like you do. The technical excellence that companies repeat…

Maybe, maybe not. Importantly, the parent didn't call him "crazy", they simply pointed out that he is hostile to workers. It's sad that people can see a good thing and think it cancels out all bad things.

I called him crazy myself (and I do think it's true), to illustrate that I am aware of his antics and it's not a reason to stop listening.

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#63

Post by whamlastxmas »

wormlord wrote: post #52
boxed wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so sad that the current culture wants to judge peoples life based on the worst they've ever done. Yea, Musk is a troll online, but his success as a business/tech leader is something you can only doubt by donning the proverbial tin foil hat.

I care less about his "troll" posts online (implying there is a conspiracy of jews importing people to destroy America is just a troll and not an actual Nazi conspiracy guys) than his manipulation of the US government, mistreatment of workers, and maybe the most egregious of all, being a fake nerd and pretending to like Evangelion.

Are you as militant about dunking on the million other people who also manipulate the government and mistreat workers to an even greater extent?

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#64

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

There are two things that don't sit right with me:

1. "the FOSS community shouldered the burden – both with our labor and our wallets – of a massive exodus onto our volunteer-operated servers" -- this implies that users actually using decentralized services is a burden, a bad thing. Or rather, that a) it would be much better if Twitter was better and people just continued using Twitter rather than FOSS platforms b) that Twitter has some kind of obligation to keep their platform good because not doing so will make people use FOSS services. If the operators don't want their service to be used, they don't have to offer it...

2. "No billionaires" as a motto, implying that having money in itself (and not a specific way of behaving) is wrong, unethical, and worthy of exclusion. That feels like an very common envy-based position, trying to tear people down because they are better off. He does have reasonable points for not wanting that specific billionaire, but the demand for exclusion is "no billionaires". Should e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Acton not be allowed/given a platform at FOSDEM?

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#65

Post by hshshshshsh »

jamespo wrote: post #38
hshshshshsh wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry. When I look at Musk I see self landing rockets, electric cars , star link etc. Obviously he seems to be quite close to truth since without getting close to reality you can't do any of these since Physics is brutal and does not reward any false assumptions. So that gives me a sense that Musk is much closer to truth than most people out there. What am I missing?

What inventors are you interested in that aren't billionaires?

Not many. I grew up in a developing country so making money and getting out of low middle class has always been on my mind since childhood. So I don't have much interest in inventors that remains poor. Though I love Feynman if you count him as an inventor. Funny enough PayPal helped me make my first income by doing a remote job when I was in school.

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#66

Post by debo_ »

phkahler wrote: post #18
debo_ wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He isn't boycotting. He is planning to peacefully protest, which I think is reasonable.

>> He isn't boycotting. He is planning to peacefully protest, which I think is reasonable. No. He's planning to forcefully disrupt by blocking the stage. Narcissistic to the core: "My views and need for attention are more important than the other 8000 people here who may want to see this talk."

Disrupting access with your physical presence is not a use of force. Without peaceful protests, people will resort to violence more often.

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#67

Post by duxup »

bambax wrote: post #60
duxup wrote: post #32

>In my view, billionaires are not welcome at FOSDEM. I see no reason to discriminate against wealth explicitly. Rather if someone's actions make them worth leaving out, then yeah that's a reason: >Dorsey is presumably being platformed in Janson because his blockchain bullshit company is a main sponsor of FOSDEM this year. That's your problem, not the money. That problem is not solved by drawing the line at personal w…

The money in itself is a problem. People with that amount of wealth are separated from the rest of humanity (and most of the time go to great lengths to make sure they absolutely never cross path with ordinary humans). They don't have the same goals as everyone else, they don't face the same issues, they contribute to climate change in extreme proportions while escaping its most urgent consequences (for the time bein…

People with not as much wealth are more reasonable or something?

I don't buy it.

We're talking about a conference that apparently puts itself up for sale in a way ... that's the problem. The other stuff is a silly distraction. You're not solving anything with a personal wreath rule, conference is still for sale. Dude with slightly less wealth is going to just buy in...

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#68

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

bogwog wrote: post #24
baggy_trough wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By listening to different points of view and deciding what best makes sense to us. That is why suppressing speech(es) is wrong.

A protest like this is basically just IRL adblock. Do you not use ad blockers because of "free speech" ideology?

I ask people for consent before I install adblock on their devices.

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#69

Post by wormlord »

throw5959 wrote: post #54
wormlord wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What other person started a rocket company from scratch and got them landing? I'd rather listen to Lars Blackmore (the engineer who is largely responsible for SpaceX powered descent). Or Gwynne Shotwell who actually oversees the business day-to-day. I'm really not interested in what the money guy has to say, especially since he is primarily interested in cultivating his public image-- how can you trust anything he…

Sure, I'm not saying Musk is the only person who has interesting things to say about it. You're absolutely correct about these other people and I listen to them too. But you're not giving Musk enough credit. All engineers and other professionals told him that landing rockets is bullshit, and what is interesting here is that he went and made it happen anyways. I'm not talking just about the engineering, everything is…

> All engineers and other professionals told him that landing rockets is bullshit

Every company has some kind of mythology where someone says "you'll never make it in this town!". The reality is that uncrewed propulsive landing was technologically feasible since the soviets landed a rover on the moon. NASA propulsively landed a rover on Mars back in 2011.

Like I said, listening to billionaires is probably interesting if your goal is "acquire boatloads of money". But we already know how to do that. 1. Appear confident 2. Lie 3. Have no morals or ethics 4. Prioritize the pursuit of power above all else

Re: No Billionares at FOSDEM

#70

Post by whamlastxmas »

isodev wrote: post #45
hshshshshsh wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry. When I look at Musk I see self landing rockets, electric cars , star link etc. Obviously he seems to be quite close to truth since without getting close to reality you can't do any of these since Physics is brutal and does not reward any false assumptions. So that gives me a sense that Musk is much closer to truth than most people out there. What am I missing?

> I see self landing rockets, electric cars , star link etc You mean brilliant people were able to achieve this despite him? I don't see why this CEO should be the one taking credit for such achievements. In fact, I believe we would probably be further into the “Space Age” if it weren't for the lost decade since he appeared on TV.

This is demented levels of cope. Musk is the most successful is basically everything he does across extremely different industries. SpaceX is a decade ahead of the next closest competitor. Tesla and self driving is wildly ahead of any other car manufacturer.
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