61–70 of 336 posts
> At this point NixOS has been around for 2 decades, but it still feels like it has not settled on good recommended workflows for incoming users.
Yes. This was a major pain point when I was getting started. The IRC community has been helpful in this regard. I also really don't like that nixpkgs serves as both a lib and a package set. Be one! I don't want "special" inputs in my config.
I've been on the fence about Nix. I've wanted to love it (and do love the concept), but between the Waiting-for-Godot situation for flakes, the weird language, and the occasional political infighting I've seen pop up about the community, I still haven't switched. I'm no language expert, but I genuinely don't understand why it wouldn't have been better to build some equivalent DSL in Haskell to do this given the simil…
I use NixOS, one of the annoying things to me is the documentation and error reports. I swapped my installation to a Flake managed install a few months ago, and parts of my Nix files that were perfectly fine before started throwing out errors (specifically HomeManager), which no amount of Googling the error message that gone thrown got me any closer to a solution. I looked at documentation recently to try and enable…
This is why I haven't switched my NixOS to flakes yet. The community discussions always act as though flakes should be the default that everyone should use now, but I figure that the developers know what they're doing and haven't made them the blessed path yet for a reason. So far so good—my system is far more stable than it was under Debian and I've yet to run into anything that didn't have an easy answer. I have a…
My take is: flakes don’t align with centralised nixpkgs and ultimately don’t solve any problems that can’t be solved without flakes.
They’re just an interface for a decentralised module system. You can use them, they’re feature-complete, and they don’t align with nixpkgs: it doesn’t make sense for individual packages to have their own flakes, nixpkgs can already be loaded as a flake.
FlakeHub tries to popularise flakes, but I don’t know if there is a flake discovery problem to solve.
Ekala Project is designing a poly-repo alternative to nixpkgs (ekapkgs) and they don’t embrace flakes.
So... Flakes have reached full maturity: a decentralised package format that has stalled its adoption status within the main Nix toolchain.
i use nixos on VMs, my desktop (Gaming and productivity) and servers. I use flakes for everything. I've painfully learned how to do everything I need. My only big complaint is updating systemd. I have yet to figure out the systemd update bug. Sometimes nixos-rebuild-switch takes my network offline when updating systemd. It's incredibly annoying to update a box and have it drop offline. My work around is to do a 'diff…
So a server that's dedicated to well-supported(by nixos) services running NixOS is awesome. it's easy to upgrade every 6 months and generally very painless. Everything else is a PITA though. Of course if you use an LTS like Debian Stable or Ubuntu, you only have to upgrade every 5-ish years, so unless you always need the latest and greatest release of something, it maybe isn't worth the hassle. Trying to hack on othe…
"Trying to hack on other people's junk with NixOS is just asking for pain." To me that's a large part of the very definition of a useful general purpose OS is that it's flexible and enables you to do whatever you need to do today, without the developers having previously somehow planned and provided for exactly that thing. It's like the systemd argument all over. The exact thing systemd aims to prevent is the exact t…
NixOS gains most of its power from restrictions. These restrictions enable awesome things like starting a shell with all dependencies in seconds versus minutes using alternative technologies (used by great effect by replit). Nix works surprisingly well for most software, but anything with a ton of dynamic dependencies is going to cause issues. Even knowing what the dependencies might be statically can be hard. Sure, providing an OS with no restrictions and complete flexibility is an option, but then you'll just end up no better off.
Whatever the future of operating systems will be, it certainly will involve more restrictions and less flexibility.
If everything you're going to do is in Nixpkgs, great! Nix will mostly "Just Work" and you'll get all the nice declarative goodness that you want. Since Nixpkgs is constantly getting updated, this isn't that weird of a thing.
The thing that's been most annoying to me is when I try and run generic Linux programs, only to be unceremoniously told "You can't run generic Linux programs in NixOS because we break dynamic linking". Suddenly something that would take about ten seconds on Ubuntu involves me, at the very least, making a Flake that has an FHS environment, or me making a package so that no one else has to deal with this crap [1]. I didn't really want to know how to make my own Nix package, and I don't really want to be stuck maintaining one now, but this is just part of Nix.
This means that it's still not something I could easily recommend to someone non-technical like my parents, unlike Ubuntu. You have to be willing and able to occasionally hack up some code if you want your system to be consistently useful.
To be clear, there's a lot of stuff I really like, I don't plan on removing it from my laptop, and for something like a server (where the audience is sort of technical by design), I really have no desire to ever use anything but NixOS, but it's a little less impressive for desktop.
The older I get, the more I realize that so much of the divide in the tech field is simply between the two camps of "the tools are the interesting part" vs "getting things done with the tools is the interesting part".
The core philosophy of Nix is so damn solid though, and that's the real innovation here. As long as its philosophy manage to stick around, then it's ok.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> as a nixpkgs developer even I don't use NixOS on the desktop that's not every encouraging :)
To counterpoint this, I'm an happy nixos desktop user. It's not perfect, but still vastly better than a non declarative distro for my taste.
NixOS gave me back my desire to customise my Linux again. I’ve run Linux since 1997; I’ve run a lot of distros.
Having to reconfigure my Linux on every hardware reset (1-2 years apart) just exhausted me to a point where I ran GNOME on Ubuntu so I wouldn’t waste time on one-off stuff.
My .emacs and .vimrc shrunk to 10% so I could reproduce them from memory if I had to.
With NixOS, installing a new machine and having it work exactly like all my machines is minutes of work.
I’ll never lose my hyper-customised setup again.
Running something like Arch or Artix again feels very much like losing my “save” button.