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Why Canada Should Join the EU

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Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#61

Tired: Canada should join the eu Wired: greenland should pacman defence[1] the USA [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pac-Man_defense

Expired: Northern California should become its own state I miss the wired/tired/expired lists greatly. Wired from 2000-2010 was a high-quality publication.

This little thread was a nice bit of nostalgia.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#62
post #54
post #19

Not outlandish, Morocco applied in 1987 but it was rejected https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morocco%E2%80%93European_Union...

The rejection was expected. The EU and its associated organizations are only open to countries on the European continent by their current rules. Canada would have to broker a hell of a deal to get even partially in. EFTA membership might be a possible goal.

> only open to countries on the European continent

Cyprus would like to have a word.

As well as potentially Armenia, Georgia, and Azerbaijan.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#63

I think this says more about the state of Canada, and the state of the EU, than it does about a good economic union. It’s like two bankrupt companies trying to form a profitable one.

I'm sorry, but what a bizarre and ridiculous way to respond to this rhetorical, largely humorous thought piece. Especially given that it's a response to Trump's continued declarations that Canada should join the US. Is Trump's constant senile yapping about absorbing Canada or Greenland or Panama also proof of how broken the US is? As a Canadian, the #1 reason I wouldn't want to join the EU is that the Schengen Agreem…

Does Canada have a migration issue? It didn’t seem that way the last time I was in Vancouver.

Meanwhile, in Europe, self-inflicted wounds from austerity, corruption, and years of ineffective policies continue to mount – and as usual, immigrants are the scapegoats. When the euro was introduced, the conversation was about harmonizing taxes, social welfare, pensions, and wages. Now, the EU celebrates forcing iPhones to adopt USB-C, as if that matters – and they pat themselves on the back for it.

Big corporations avoiding taxes in Ireland? Silence. German companies suppressing wages by threatening to relocate to Poland? Why not raise wages in Poland and create a fairer landscape?

These days, the EU feels more like an extension of NATO than a representative body. Its survival so far seems like a miracle, but I wouldn’t place bets on its future. The normalization of parties like AfD, pushing to exit the EU, adds to the uncertainty.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#64
post #34

I think people are quite tired of the harms of a centralized globalization effort - whether from a decentralized cabal or official part of law and official government agreements.

On the contrary, I think we’re finally realising the benefits of centralisation. Separatism and isolation are things of the past.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#65
post #19

Not outlandish, Morocco applied in 1987 but it was rejected https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morocco%E2%80%93European_Union...

The difference is that Morocco has a lot to win by joining europe, whereas Canada doesn't.

Canadian GDP per capita is 15 times that of Morocco. The EU would much rather admit a wealthy country than a relatively poor one. So there are clear economic reasons to treat the two differently.

Canada is a longstanding liberal democracy with a distant and purely symbolic constitutional monarchy. Morocco is a constitutional monarchy in which (until recently at least) the monarch played an active political role, there is still a widespread expectation among the population that he ought to do so, multiparty democracy is young and weak, and security agencies engage in repressive behaviour. [0] So there's political reasons too.

If Canada really wanted the EU and the EU really wanted Canada, they'd fudge the whole geography issue–probably won't happen but not completely impossible. But no way the EU is going to want Morocco any time this century, so they won't do it for them.

[0] https://carnegieendowment.org/sada/2023/07/morocco-a-brewing...

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#67
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rejection was expected. The EU and its associated organizations are only open to countries on the European continent by their current rules. Canada would have to broker a hell of a deal to get even partially in. EFTA membership might be a possible goal.

> only open to countries on the European continent Cyprus would like to have a word. As well as potentially Armenia, Georgia, and Azerbaijan.

Re: Cyprus, the rule may be being on the same tectonic plate, which AFAICT, Cyprus is (the Eurasian plate).

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#68
post #52

As someone who has lived in the EU for over 20 years, I can say that the Schengen Area is a fantastic thing, whereas the EU itself is a disaster. Civilized countries should join the Schengen Area but avoid joining the European Union (these are two separate things). They should take an example from Norway, Iceland, Switzerland, and Liechtenstein - countries that are part of Schengen but not in the EU. Joining the Euro…

Factually, the claim of complete loss of sovereignty is just dead wrong. This list details the division of responsibilities between the EU and member states: https://commission.europa.eu/about/role/law/areas-eu-action_...

This shows how narrow the responsibilities of the EU actually are.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#69

> Canada’s inclusive treatment of its indigenous peoples, at least in recent decades, could be emulated by Europeans (though First Nations Canadians might fairly object to closer ties with ex-colonists) I really wonder what the author meant with this line. There's very few populations in Europe that bear any similarity whatsoever with the relationship between First Nations people and most Canadians, since most popula…

Ireland springs to mind, and in fact has strong ties to Indigenous nations in the Americas for their similar struggles

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#70
> Europeans could learn from Canada how to allow immigration in a fashion that the population embraces rather than tolerates, though a housing crunch has frayed that consensus of late

A little bit of an understatement, that consensus has almost been completely shattered in Canada.

Currently Canada can barely handle the people it has, there's quite a severe housing crisis. There's just not enough housing in any of the areas that people want to live. Canada does not need more people.

And most of the people hypothetically moving to Canada from Europe will probably be refugees who have little ties to Europe. Which would also not go down well in Canada (because of uhh, human tendencies against the outgroup).

Personally, I'm pro-immigration. It keeps the cost of labour down which is good for people like me. I just think even the current level of immigration has been too destabilizing for our society, so I'm opposed to increasing it yet further.

That being said, as a Canadian I'd love to have the right to live and work in the EU, and I would love for honest hard-working Europeans to have the right to live and work in Canada. And I'd love closer and denser trade ties, for example an investment in LNG shipping infrastructure to help Canada and the EU, assuming this is economical and not just a pipe dream.

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