Some of these points are quite good. I've followed Buddhism quite a lot, taking the view that if you ignore the reincarnation bit (which was probably inherited from other religions in the area buddhism sprang from) then buddhism isn't really a religion at all, its more like a philosophy. I've seen people at buddhist retreats suggest some wilds benefits to meditation (magic powers etc). Thats clearly nonsense. But one…
Buddhism is definitely a religion. The founder of the religion himself talked about an order of monks. What happens with Buddhism in particular, especially in the West, is that people pick and choose what they want to believe from it to the point that whatever they're left with is hardly Buddhism at all, and it does end up being a philosophy. For an example, ask the next white person you meet who identities as a Budd…
> is that people pick and choose what they want to believe
Pretty sure this is SOP for basically every religion. :)
This was from 2003. I think at the time the author(John Horgan) was a kind of a 'religion debunker', and maybe he had latched onto a few sects of Buddhism that sound kind of 'Christian' and 'debunkable'. He has some follow up writings that indicate his views on Buddhism may have shifted. From 2023 https://johnhorgan.org/cross-check/a-buddhism-critic-goes-on... "But I’m glad I went on the retreat. The Lama, during our…
Thanks for posting that link. It's a must-read followup.
The Greeks and Indians are closer to each other culturally than people are willing to admit. They should be considered cousins in terms of their philosophy, cultural, and religion. That there were Greek states and colonies in Norther India/Gandhara that spoke Greek for generations is not given enough scrutiny imo. The cultural impact of that transmission not always clear outside of something concrete. Like the most o…
True! Buddha and Alexander the Great were really only 100 years apart. Greeks and Hindu deities have many similarities. The trimurthi of Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva correlates pretty closely to Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades. It works the other way as well as I think Greek philosophy also got influenced by Hindu/Buddhist world view like Stocism. Both sides seem to have benefited with the ideas of the other especially along math…
The root for the Gods is perhaps even older than that and comes from a yet older culture.
> if you squint Christianity sort of resembles a mesh of Jewish and Buddhist philosophy.
Buddhism originated the entire concept of a "savior" and for the first time introduced the idea of conversion in religion.
"Meditation can even exacerbate depression, anxiety, and other negative emotions in certain people." If the author had put enough serious time in meditation, he would notice that meditation doesn't exacerbate negative emotions, it just makes you aware of the negative emotions that were already there and that you were ignoring by social media, alcohol, drugs, tiktok, etc. Meditation makes you aware of where the proble…
The anecdotal claims from you and the author are the sort which I'm hesitant to believe without a study of more people.
It's not entirely anecdotal. There's research that shows meditation can hasten the progression of mental illnesses like suicidal depression and schizophrenia. For example, suicide rates spike among neophyte practitioners of meditation, and those with latent schizophrenia are more likely (i.e. earlier than others) to experience their first psychotic break when beginning meditation. AFAIU, Buddhist teachers, pre-modern and modern, were and are taught to pay attention to warning signs of people experiencing pathological mental issues brought on by meditation. And while I haven't read of it specifically, I would think the phenomenon would also be found in, e.g., contemplative Christian communities (e.g. monastic communities or contemplative retreats). None of this implies meditation is bad, just that it's important that people learn meditation techniques in a supportive, non-isolating environment (i.e. with a well-trained teacher or experienced community) so that the small fraction of those who might respond negatively can be helped. This type of environment would indeed tend to be found within traditional religious institutions and communities, as opposed to following a YouTube video or website howto at home.
> accept Christ as your Lord Okay, why not? Then comes all stuff about what does this mean in practice and theory. And there are so many forms of Christianity arguing. The simplest one of them still is just be mindful and kind, for the sake of the Lord who was and is.
You are conflating belief systems and behavioral patterns. Christianity is a belief system populated by folks who follow Christ as Lord. Full stop. This Kumbaya Collective you describe is a behavioral pattern that many folks take part in. Some of them may happen to be Christian, others may not. But to observe that some Christians are part of the Kumbaya Collective and then go on to imply that being part of the collec…
I believe you are committing the no true Scotsman fallacy, by claiming Christianity is a belief in Christ as lord.
I myself was raised in a Christian organization that did not believe Christ was lord, but rather a person sent by god to show us by example, how to be, spiritually, in order to enter the kingdom of heaven. They also don’t believe in the holy trinity.
So do consider that you do not speak for all Christian’s and not all Christian’s hold the same beliefs.
This was from 2003. I think at the time the author(John Horgan) was a kind of a 'religion debunker', and maybe he had latched onto a few sects of Buddhism that sound kind of 'Christian' and 'debunkable'. He has some follow up writings that indicate his views on Buddhism may have shifted. From 2023 https://johnhorgan.org/cross-check/a-buddhism-critic-goes-on... "But I’m glad I went on the retreat. The Lama, during our…
Thanks for sharing, that's a good follow-up. Surya Das is a well-respected teacher so he found a good one to go to retreat with.
The quote from the lama is excellent as well and a very common type of expression that Dzogchen masters make.
While I've never heard it put exactly that way I have been listening to a lot of Ram Dass and he has a few talks where he discusses Trungpa Rinpoche ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C3%B6gyam_Trungpa#Controver... ). The way I remember it for Ram Dass he saw Trungpa as enlightened so all the "bad" stuff he did was sort of ok because that was Trungpa's dharma and he did it in a detached state. I understood it like..…
Or maybe his brutal exile from Tibet due to Chinese invasion traumatized him in some way. I’m not a fan of rationalizing abusive behavior or hypocrisy. People can gain a lot of skill at something but it doesn’t make them a good person. Elon Musk falls in a similar category IMO.
I don't think enlightened beings can be traumatized. A better theory I've heard it's that it is easy to keep vows when you live in a temple and never been tempted.
This was from 2003. I think at the time the author(John Horgan) was a kind of a 'religion debunker', and maybe he had latched onto a few sects of Buddhism that sound kind of 'Christian' and 'debunkable'. He has some follow up writings that indicate his views on Buddhism may have shifted. From 2023 https://johnhorgan.org/cross-check/a-buddhism-critic-goes-on... "But I’m glad I went on the retreat. The Lama, during our…
Hah, excellent, thank you for the context (admittedly as someone reading the comments to see if the post is worth reading)! He also has a book on entheogens (edit: and other “transcendental technologies” like fasting, meditation, prayer etc.) iirc, from around the same period - Rational Mysticism - which I remember being a pretty good read.
Or maybe his brutal exile from Tibet due to Chinese invasion traumatized him in some way. I’m not a fan of rationalizing abusive behavior or hypocrisy. People can gain a lot of skill at something but it doesn’t make them a good person. Elon Musk falls in a similar category IMO.
I don't think enlightened beings can be traumatized. A better theory I've heard it's that it is easy to keep vows when you live in a temple and never been tempted.
My memory is that he had to escape through the Himalayas as a teenager. I don’t think teenagers can be enlightened beings. He failed to keep 2 of the 5 layperson Buddhist vows - a temple has nothing to do with it. From what I understand jhana >> booze, so why choose booze?