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Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

marinecorpstimes.com

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Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#61

Post by dialup_sounds »

jasonlotito wrote: post #23
defrost wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in hindsight, no. What sucks for the pilot is he followed procedure and at the time had no way of knowing whether the craft would remain stable or totally brick and spiral any second (rendering a procedural ejection even more dangerous).

> VMX-1 is in charge of assessing the Corps’ aircraft and helping develop and refine tactics, techniques and procedures to fly them in combat successfully. > What sucks for the pilot is he followed procedure He was the commander. He defines those procedures.

The crash happened in September of 2023. He was made commander of VMX-1 in June of 2024.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#62

Post by tzs »

jasonlotito wrote: post #26
synapsomorphy wrote: post #7

The report criticizes the pilot for ejecting, but also says he did everything by the book (F35 manual), but the book was wrong. And the pilot should've figured that out? Feels like they just need someone to blame for losing the plane.

FTA: VMX-1 is in charge of assessing the Corps’ aircraft and helping develop and refine tactics, techniques and procedures to fly them in combat successfully. He was the commander of VMX-1. They effectively write the book. "And the pilot should've figured that out?" Yes. That's the job.

I doubt that the job is to figure out updates to the book when an unplanned failure occurs over a heavily populated civilian area.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#63

Post by underseacables »

I think it is grossly unfair what happened to the pilot. He followed orders, followed procedure, followed the damn manual. Wholly inappropriate response by the marine corps. I can only assume that it got political and the brass got embarrassed.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#64

Post by s1artibartfast »

serf wrote: post #39
jonas21 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also note that he wasn't fired specifically due to ejecting -- he was fired "for loss of trust and confidence in his ability to execute the responsibilities of his command." And the investigation was completed back in January, so before he assumed command of the squadron. It wouldn't surprise me if the test pilots serving under him did not respect or trust his judgement, and this is what led to his firing rather than…

that's the same boiler-plate reason they give for every firing due to an embarrassing mishap. google 'for loss of trust and confidence in his ability military' and look at the news tab, every embarrassment to a military group gets thrown that bone.

seems reasonable to me. If someone lost a 110 million dollar asset in a questionable way, I wouldn't have trust and confidence in their ability either.

Flying cutting edge military jets isn't exactly a human right.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#65

Post by s1artibartfast »

margalabargala wrote: post #37
krunck wrote: post #16

The pilot had a justifiable lack of faith in the aircraft and didn't care to be the next pilot victim.

For those downvoting you, the "justifiable lack of faith" here, above and beyond what was enumerated in the article, is that at the time this happened there had been two fatal F35 malfunctions/crashes in the preceding six weeks. I don't blame the pilot for not wanting to become another statistic.

Per the article, the other crashes weren't F35s. They were a "F/A-18D Hornet in southern California, which killed its pilot, and an MV-22 Osprey crash in Australia that killed three Marines."

I dont blame someone if they were to get scared and bail, but I also dont blame the marines if they dont want people like that flying their 110 million dollar jets.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#66

Post by thrill »

arghwhat wrote: post #24
Manuel_D wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Del Pizzo’s F-35B malfunctioned and its primary displays and communications cut out as Del Pizzo was attempting to land through rain at Joint Base Charleston, South Carolina. However, the report said its standby flight display and backup communication system “remained basically functional.” > The report said Del Pizzo followed the F-35B manual’s recommendations for ejecting from an out-of-control jet but also criti…

That really, really depends on what conditions you are flying under. This is not a naturally stable aircraft flown at relatively low speeds far away from any obstacle, and it is not being flown from a couch with a gamepad. Even if he fucked up severely and needlessly burned an insanely expensive asset at the cost of tax payers, that’s a fuckup from an individual actually qualified for and skilled at flying the thing,…

The flight control software was not malfunctioning. He had instruments and communication capability that would have let him land an otherwise flyable aircraft.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#67

Post by thrill »

jtbayly wrote: post #55
elif wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

64 miles the school bus sized rocket flew before crashing into some suburb. Imagine if someone accidentally fired a tomahawk missile in South Carolina for some reason by procedure. The operator had 10 minutes to cancel but instead acted prematurely.

It takes 10 minutes to fall 2000 feet? Then why do the instructions say eject if you’re below 6k?

Normally such instructions say to eject if you're out of control below some specific altitude that the ejection system is known to be capable of operating within.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#68

Post by bigfatkitten »

michaelt wrote: post #32
talldayo wrote: post #3

> “How in the hell do you lose an F-35?” Mace posted on X, formerly known as Twitter. “How is there not a tracking device and we’re asking the public to what, find a jet and turn it in?” This sounds like a potent critique of 5th generation fighters but it's quite not. The F-35 is meant to be lost - it can't even use standard Link 16 because it reveals too much of it's presence to enemy fighters. The idea of it lackin…

I mean, stealth is all very well when nobody's ejected. But shouldn't an ejection trigger some sort of beacon? We probably want to find the pilot, after all. You'd think the military's budget could stretch to a $300 Garmin InReach.

> We probably want to find the pilot, after all.

You don't want the enemy to find the pilot.

That's why pilots carry these, which they can use when it's operationally safe for them to do so.

https://gdmissionsystems.com/products/communications/radios/...

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#69

Post by 4ad »

tzs wrote: post #60
dragonwriter wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was, and was fired from his role as, commander of Marine Operational Test and Evaluation Squadron 1 (VMX-1), which exists largely to validate and update “the book” for the rest of Corps. So, if there is any position where simply “following the book” isn’t adequate to keep one’s job, it kind of makes sense that his was that position.

The ejection was months before he got the role at VMX-1. Even if it had been after he got the role I'm not sure it should matter. I'd expect validating and updating "the book" to be a carefully planned and methodical activity, with alternate approaches tested during simulated failure or failures induced under controlled conditions. Would they really expect a pilot who encounters a failure not under such conditions to…

Plus this idea of "updating the book" makes it sound like this was some sort of experimental aircraft where they still have to finalize the manual. This is a production aircraft, over 1000 were built, it is deployed in 30+ countries.

Re: Marine pilot loses command after ejecting from F-35B that kept flying

#70

Post by dyauspitr »

synapsomorphy wrote: post #7

The report criticizes the pilot for ejecting, but also says he did everything by the book (F35 manual), but the book was wrong. And the pilot should've figured that out? Feels like they just need someone to blame for losing the plane.

The pilot should have figured it out especially since all the controls were working. It’s like he ejected from a $100 million aircraft because one of the screens went out.
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