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What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

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Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#61
post #55
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certificate transparency is intended to solve this issue.

[flagged]

The Snowden leaks made it clear that so long as the government has the means and motive to perform some kind of surveillance, they'll do exactly that. It may not be through the exact methods people are suggesting, but rest assured it is happening.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#63

This sort of thing is exactly why I have automatic updates disabled on my Windows partition. I've been burned so many times by bad Windows updates breaking stuff. My favourite is when stuff breaks during the "configuring updates" stage after a reboot, leaving Windows in a boot loop with no error codes or anything to help you figure it out. And of course the documentation from MS is utter garbage. Most of the time the…

My Windows install is stuck in a boot loop like this - it spends 10 minutes trying to update and then fails, except maybe 1/3 times it then boots normally. I don't even try to do anything about it, I just marvel at it.

Last time I saw a computer do that it was due to bad memory sticks.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#64
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really bad advice—don't follow it. Zero day vulnerabilities are a thing, and you intentionally prevent yourself from getting those fixed quickly. Running critical software without updating may have been possible in some distant past, but it isn't any longer: You will catch an exploit or crypto locker at some point. Microsoft abusing its update mechanism to pushing crap is nothing new, but downright refusing u…

When a windows update destroys your install, is it really any different from actual malware? I consider it one and protect myself accordingly. At least you can be careful about the rest with adblocking, sandboxing and being irrelevant enough to not make your machine a target for anyone competent, which gives you a pretty great chance at avoiding them. If you keep built-in malware (and in recent versions, also spyware…

> At least you can be careful about the rest with adblocking, sandboxing and being irrelevant enough to not make your machine a target for anyone competent, which gives you a pretty great chance at avoiding them.

That maybe used to be a thing, but isn't anymore really: There only needs to be a single, unpatched vulnerability in your network stack, the multitude of devices around you, whether at home, work, or in a cafe, none of which you control, might exploit.

And one more little piece of trivia; high levels of expertise usually come with increased negligence on the basics, because you're less careful. This affects pilots and nerds alike; just think of Ross Ulbricht.

Good luck :)

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#66

This sort of thing is exactly why I have automatic updates disabled on my Windows partition. I've been burned so many times by bad Windows updates breaking stuff. My favourite is when stuff breaks during the "configuring updates" stage after a reboot, leaving Windows in a boot loop with no error codes or anything to help you figure it out. And of course the documentation from MS is utter garbage. Most of the time the…

[flagged]

> Okay? Okay. Rant over.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#67
Interesting. The question that immediately popped into my head was: How does the secure boot system determine the “security generation” of GRUB exactly? Sounds like just based on the assertion of GRUB itself (and trusted signature of the distribution that built GRUB)?

The fact that the list of allowed GRUB versions is itself manageable via a Windows Update points to some other issues with this particular security scheme, given Microsoft’s own recent history of mishandling private keys.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#68

This sort of thing is exactly why I have automatic updates disabled on my Windows partition. I've been burned so many times by bad Windows updates breaking stuff. My favourite is when stuff breaks during the "configuring updates" stage after a reboot, leaving Windows in a boot loop with no error codes or anything to help you figure it out. And of course the documentation from MS is utter garbage. Most of the time the…

[flagged]

> I thought flatpak would fix this on linux, but every time I flatpak itself updates half of its apps break with mysterious error messages and refuse to launch until they're also updated.

Linux oldheads could've told you this would happen before the project was even created. We solved package management and dependencies in the 90s and no one has improved on it since. Just stick with stuff in your distro's repos. If it's not in the repos, don't use it. Problems gone.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#69

I think there's more than meets the eye here. I think part of the reason MS is enforcing TPM2.0 and now this SBAT update is that there is widespread rootkit level malware and they are trying to stay ahead of the curve. When it comes to the realities of dual-booting, I had tons of problems with Win7/8/10 with suspend-to-hiberfile.sys issues and updates 10 years ago breaking grub. 10 years ago I finally decided, "You k…

> When it comes to the realities of dual-booting

The sad and depressing part is that along the way we lost all possibilities of running coreboot or libreboot as an open alternative.

The only real option is to buy a used laptop from before the T44x generation (if you really want it secure)... or newer machines that come with other perks like soldered-on batteries that destroy the mainboard along with them when they leak out eventually.

I am not sure what the consumer rights protection agencies on the planet are doing, but seemingly they've been asleep at the wheel for way too long now.

> (Tinfoil hat) (...) I think part of the reason MS is enforcing TPM2.0 and now this SBAT update is that there is widespread rootkit level malware and they are trying to stay ahead of the curve.

The only vendors that seem to do something against it are somewhat System76, Frame.Work, Purism and maybe Starlabs. But the huge majority of devices is under the absolute control of Microsoft's signing process now. So I would argue that this isn't a tinfoil conspiracy, but a strategical decision that MS made to re-grab their lost power on x86 systems.

Re: What is an SBAT and why does everyone suddenly care

#70
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When a windows update destroys your install, is it really any different from actual malware? I consider it one and protect myself accordingly. At least you can be careful about the rest with adblocking, sandboxing and being irrelevant enough to not make your machine a target for anyone competent, which gives you a pretty great chance at avoiding them. If you keep built-in malware (and in recent versions, also spyware…

> At least you can be careful about the rest with adblocking, sandboxing and being irrelevant enough to not make your machine a target for anyone competent, which gives you a pretty great chance at avoiding them. That maybe used to be a thing, but isn't anymore really: There only needs to be a single, unpatched vulnerability in your network stack, the multitude of devices around you, whether at home, work, or in a ca…

Windows updates are too dangerous to trust automatically. I've been burned to various degrees too many times to think otherwise. If Windows is too dangerous to use without automatic updates, then it's just too dangerous to use, period.
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