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RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

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Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#61

Post by J_Shelby_J »

fragmede wrote: post #60
stavros wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah ok, it's at least comforting to know that I missed it, rather than there are superhuman developers that crank these projects out in an afternoon.

I've had some fun converting some of my Python scripts into Rust and it's really not that difficult with the help of modern tools once you wrap your head around Rust. Python is too huge to crank out in an afternoon, for sure, but on the human level, the translation from python to something compiled is a well trod path.

The one time cost of learning borrow rules and traits is steep, but the lifetime savings of cargo vs PIP probably hits break even after a few months.

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#62

Post by nextaccountic »

Does numpy runs on rustpython? And other libraries used in ML (not expecting compatibility with huge libraries like torch or tensorflow, but rather, getting the leaves to work should be doable)

If not, is it at all possible to get numpy to work and other libraries written in native code? I see that rustpython also work in wasm: but what about compiling numpy's native code to wasm as well?

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#63

Post by stavros »

charliermarsh wrote: post #56
stavros wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really looking forward to uv being a drop-in replacement for Poetry. I don't know if that's what they're planning to do, though. Does it currently have all the niceties of Poetry (dependency management, locks, building wheels, etc?).

Yeah, that's definitely within scope for what we're trying to build, and we've been hard at work on extending uv to support those workflows (platform-agnostic resolution, lockfiles, etc.). Honestly, a lot of it is already implemented, but not yet stabilized or announced. Coming soon.

Fantastic, I'm really looking forward to that!

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#64

Post by KolenCh »

wredue wrote: post #53
actinium226 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How fast does it really need to be? On my M2 macbook air: $ time A=1 B=1 python -c "import os; print(int(os.getenv('A'))+int(os.getenv('B')))" 2 real 0m0.068s user 0m0.029s sys 0m0.026s

Eh. Once you start using imports, python slows down dramatically. So I guess it really just depends what your scripts use.

Regarding import cost, as it’s doing heavy IO traversing the file system, the cost heavily depends on how fast you can do IO in the hardware, and also the file system (and the OS).

So a fast SSD will help, and somewhat surprisingly putting it inside docker helps (in an HPC context, not so sure it’s implications here as we’re talking about a short scripts.)

But the context here is to port shell scripts to Python, I’m not sure how huge amounts of imports matters.

And it is probably an intrinsic problem of the language, unless we start talking about compiling (and somehow statically) not interpreting the Python program, whichever implementation of the language probably won’t help the situation.

Lastly, if high startup costs of the script becomes relevant, perhaps it is orchestrating wrong. This is an infamous problem of Julia, and their practice is then just keep the Julia instance alive and use it as “the shell”. Similarly, you can do so in Python. Ie rather than calling a script from the shell acting on millions of things, write a wrapper script that start the Python instance once. Memory leak could be a problem if it or its dependencies are not well written but even in that case you have ways to deal with that.

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#65

Post by KolenCh »

cutler wrote: post #36

While you're at it fix Python's crippled lambdas and ...

I wonder why you stops there midway in a sentence and only after reading the other comments I get what you mean … What problems you are referring to exactly, and how would they be fixed as an implementation but not at the language level?

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#66

Post by sn9 »

J_Shelby_J wrote: post #61
fragmede wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had some fun converting some of my Python scripts into Rust and it's really not that difficult with the help of modern tools once you wrap your head around Rust. Python is too huge to crank out in an afternoon, for sure, but on the human level, the translation from python to something compiled is a well trod path.

The one time cost of learning borrow rules and traits is steep, but the lifetime savings of cargo vs PIP probably hits break even after a few months.

Not to mention the change in rate of runtime errors.

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#67

Post by jbernsteiniv »

J_Shelby_J wrote: post #61
fragmede wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had some fun converting some of my Python scripts into Rust and it's really not that difficult with the help of modern tools once you wrap your head around Rust. Python is too huge to crank out in an afternoon, for sure, but on the human level, the translation from python to something compiled is a well trod path.

The one time cost of learning borrow rules and traits is steep, but the lifetime savings of cargo vs PIP probably hits break even after a few months.

Also if evolution has shown us anything we will all one day evolve into crab. Crab is the final form (Carcinisation).

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#69

Post by RsmFz »

stavros wrote: post #43
pansa2 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't these things take a massive amount of effort? Yes, RustPython has been in development since at least 2018. > Wouldn't this be making waves much earlier in its development process? It's been posted on HN several times before: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=rustpython

Ah ok, it's at least comforting to know that I missed it, rather than there are superhuman developers that crank these projects out in an afternoon.

I cranked out a Lua interpreter implemented in Rust in a week or two.

It only ran about 3x slower than PUC Lua... And never collected garbage either :P

Re: RustPython: A Python Interpreter Written in Rust

#70

Post by willcipriano »

stavros wrote: post #43
pansa2 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't these things take a massive amount of effort? Yes, RustPython has been in development since at least 2018. > Wouldn't this be making waves much earlier in its development process? It's been posted on HN several times before: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=rustpython

Ah ok, it's at least comforting to know that I missed it, rather than there are superhuman developers that crank these projects out in an afternoon.

Implementing a interpreter like that isn't as hard as you probably think as the standard library does a lot of the heavy lifting once you have the basics.

It's still a lot of work but the only need to make the "built in" parts of the language and that's a lot smaller subset.

Example of what im talking about: https://github.com/RustPython/RustPython/pull/3858

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