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Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

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Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#61

Post by spacebanana7 »

jampekka wrote: post #48
kriops wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think for more than a few seconds on the matter, you quickly realise that intellectual property is a moral necessity, because intellectual expropriation (which is what you are really talking about) would destroy a major incentive for positive contributions to society. Everything political is rooted in morality, and while it is easy to point out political challenges on the topic, intellectual property is ethica…

I have thought on the matter for millions of seconds. Politics and economics don't have anything to do with morality. It's about power. The moral fairytailes are there to justify whatever the state of affairs are. When these change, new fairytales justifying them will be adopted. If right to property is a God given right, why the hell I as a atheist should give a damn?

> If right to property is a God given right, why the hell I as a atheist should give a damn?

You can argue it from political necessity.

Some kind of property rights are necessary for the operation of any social group. Even in a communist society you can't have the air force stealing land from the navy, or the transport department taking electricity from hospitals, or neighbours taking each others food allocations.

There needs to be some kind of organised transfer of property or you get chaos.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#62

Post by echelon »

barrkel wrote: post #52

I was forwarded a message just moments ago by my mother, a 5 second Facebook video, clearly AI generated - and I suspect Open Sora. More AI slop for everyone.

I know AI will be used to spam, but to not see or acknowledge the positive capabilities of this technology is absolutely flabbergasting to me.

This is going to make filmmaking cheap and accessible to a broad audience, and that's nothing short of a miracle.

I typically do each year's 48 hour film project with a team of 8 or more people. This year I did it with myself and an editor, and it was amazing - no 6 AM trip to the prop house, no lifting heavy props from the top shelf, no signing location release forms, no sweltering lights. I didn't have to put on makeup or do blocking for hours. (I used mocap, rotoscoping, and compositing.)

I've been using AI diffusion canvases to design - something I'd previously found entirely intimidating and unapproachable. I'm having so much fun and enjoyment with this.

I don't see the world the same way, and I don't get this negativity.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#63

Post by infostud »

kriops wrote: post #41
jampekka wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is a positive turn of events. Intellectual property as a concept needs to go.

If you think for more than a few seconds on the matter, you quickly realise that intellectual property is a moral necessity, because intellectual expropriation (which is what you are really talking about) would destroy a major incentive for positive contributions to society. Everything political is rooted in morality, and while it is easy to point out political challenges on the topic, intellectual property is ethica…

Most creators work for hire and the company owns the IP. Anecdote: I can't remember the song written on a bus and sold to the record company for $250 to keep food on the table that has earnt billions for Warner, Sony, or Universal Music. Nothing more for the creator. Big company stealing from another big company to benefit the rest of us? Seems like fair use. Nothing to do with creators. That incentive was meant to be something like 20 years (same as patents) not almost "forever" like the Mouse wants who expropriated from all of those European folktales and sanitised them. No incentive if you live off the earnings of a "one-hit wonder".

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#64

Post by barrkel »

echelon wrote: post #62
barrkel wrote: post #52

I was forwarded a message just moments ago by my mother, a 5 second Facebook video, clearly AI generated - and I suspect Open Sora. More AI slop for everyone.

I know AI will be used to spam, but to not see or acknowledge the positive capabilities of this technology is absolutely flabbergasting to me. This is going to make filmmaking cheap and accessible to a broad audience, and that's nothing short of a miracle. I typically do each year's 48 hour film project with a team of 8 or more people. This year I did it with myself and an editor, and it was amazing - no 6 AM trip to…

I get it. I play with image generation myself, with the odd bit of training and fine-tuning. But you have to recognize that the low marginal cost of this kind of generation is self-cheapening, and a world filled with gaudy saccharine content (the kind of stuff that wins RLHF head to head comparisons) upvoted and shared by people who don't recognize it for what it is, is a little bit dispiriting.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#65

Post by voidUpdate »

Gormo wrote: post #55
voidUpdate wrote: post #15

"pretty good" is definitely one point of view... all those videos look very blobby and morph-y

If you want to make an adjective out of an English noun, just add a 'y' directly to the end of it, e.g. 'morphy'. The hyphen is erroneous here: 'morph-y' would be pronounced like 'morph why', and has the structure of a compound modifier without making any sense as one.

That doesn't always work in a way that's clear, though. If I said a microcontroller felt pretty army, that's different to saying it feels arm-y, since army is already a word. I wasn't trying to say that it was like chess player Paul Morphy, I was trying to indicate it was an adjective derived from "morph". Language is meant to convey meaning, and you understood the meaning I was trying to convey, so what's the issue?

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#66

Post by wk_end »

Gormo wrote: post #55
voidUpdate wrote: post #15

"pretty good" is definitely one point of view... all those videos look very blobby and morph-y

If you want to make an adjective out of an English noun, just add a 'y' directly to the end of it, e.g. 'morphy'. The hyphen is erroneous here: 'morph-y' would be pronounced like 'morph why', and has the structure of a compound modifier without making any sense as one.

I'm a native English (Canadian) speaker and, given this context, would never pronounce "morph-y" as "morph why" (if that pronunciation was intended I'd capitalize the Y and probably not hyphenate it, "Morph Y").

Indeed, sometimes I'll use the -y construction when I'm inventing an adjective from a noun like this, especially if omitting it looks "wrong" to me because it's an invented word (not sure if I would've for "morphy" but whatever).

I don't know if you're a native speaker and there's some kind of cultural or generational gap here where some of us are more/less particular about this than others or if you're a non-native speaker trying to be helpful but underestimating the flexibility of casual written English.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#67

Post by spacebanana7 »

jampekka wrote: post #23
__loam wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI developers don't care about intellectual property.

Which is a positive turn of events. Intellectual property as a concept needs to go.

Intellectual property in the form of trademarks is generally good for consumers, you don't want a new database product to be called Postgres despite no association with the developers of PostgreSQL.

Intellectual property in the form of patents and copyrights is often harmful for consumers. In music, academia and mechanical engineering it's clearly been harmful in slowing the spread of innovation. It sucks to wait 20 years for a new excellent new dishwasher tray shape.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#68

Post by selestify »

ADeerAppeared wrote: post #40
jampekka wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is a positive turn of events. Intellectual property as a concept needs to go.

No. AI firms are a good example of precisely why copyright was put in place. Right now, AI is taking people's original works and rehashing them in a way that directly competes with the original work . Some AI firms (e.g. perplexity) just have their LLMs paraphrase the work lightly. This is a problem because it drives original work out of business. Even setting aside matters of originality, artistic value, and AI bein…

We should find new ways to fund essential services like journalism and the arts, rather than artificially crimping the possibilities of new technology in order to get a half-assed solution under the current paradigm.

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#69

Post by voidUpdate »

echelon wrote: post #62
barrkel wrote: post #52

I was forwarded a message just moments ago by my mother, a 5 second Facebook video, clearly AI generated - and I suspect Open Sora. More AI slop for everyone.

I know AI will be used to spam, but to not see or acknowledge the positive capabilities of this technology is absolutely flabbergasting to me. This is going to make filmmaking cheap and accessible to a broad audience, and that's nothing short of a miracle. I typically do each year's 48 hour film project with a team of 8 or more people. This year I did it with myself and an editor, and it was amazing - no 6 AM trip to…

You've hit the nail on the head. Its good at designing. But you can see from the visual quality of the examples that its not ready to be used as final content. No AI content I've seen is really ready to be used as a final piece, It shouldn't only ever really be the basis for something. I have no issues with an AI generated piece being used as a "sketch" or a "storyboard" but using it for a final product is just... lazy and looks crap?

Re: Open-Sora does pretty good video generation on consumer GPUs

#70

Post by jampekka »

spacebanana7 wrote: post #61
jampekka wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have thought on the matter for millions of seconds. Politics and economics don't have anything to do with morality. It's about power. The moral fairytailes are there to justify whatever the state of affairs are. When these change, new fairytales justifying them will be adopted. If right to property is a God given right, why the hell I as a atheist should give a damn?

> If right to property is a God given right, why the hell I as a atheist should give a damn? You can argue it from political necessity. Some kind of property rights are necessary for the operation of any social group. Even in a communist society you can't have the air force stealing land from the navy, or the transport department taking electricity from hospitals, or neighbours taking each others food allocations. Th…

You can argue divine right of kings or white supremacy from political necessity.

Some kind of systems to allocate scarce resources is needed. This doesn't have to be property. Access to e.g. the moon and earth's orbits and international waters and polar regions have systems of allocation, but they are not property.

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