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AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

gizmodo.com

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Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#61

Post by luma »

bradley13 wrote: post #5

In some cases an AI will make a weird word choice. So do a lot of humans. Sometimes AIs are needlessly wordy. Um...so are a lot of humans. Rinse and repeat. AI detectors are useless. The AIs are training on human writing, so they write fundamentally like humans. How is this not obvious?

OpenAI announced that they had started on an AI text detector and then gave up as the problem appears to be unsolvable. The machine creates statistically probable text from the input, applying statistics to the generated result will show nothing more than exactly that. You’re then left triggering false positives on text that is the most likely which makes the whole thing useless.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#62

Post by HPsquared »

immibis wrote: post #43
giancarlostoro wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, I could care less if an author uses AI as long as I can understand what I'm reading and it's interesting. They still have to instruct the AI.

If you're reading nonfiction, it means you're wasting time reading a lot more words when you could have just read the prompt.

Depends on your own level of background knowledge vs. the author's.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#63

Post by amonith »

retrac98 wrote: post #55
amonith wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, eventually AI will write like humans but currently most of the time it's very much apparent what was written by AI. English is my second language so it's hard for me to pinpoint the exact reason why but I guess it's more about the tone and the actual content (a.k.a bullshit) rather than grammar / choice of words. Most of the time AI slop reads like a soulless corporate ad. Probably because most of the content the…

If the AI writing is good, you’re not going to know it’s written by AI and you’ll continue to think you "can always tell" while more and more of what you read isn’t written by humans.

Yeah but to reach that point you will probably need those "useless AI detectors" (as stated by the comment I was replying to). That was my point - we're not there yet therefore those tools can be useful.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#64

Post by jgalt212 »

luma wrote: post #61
bradley13 wrote: post #5

In some cases an AI will make a weird word choice. So do a lot of humans. Sometimes AIs are needlessly wordy. Um...so are a lot of humans. Rinse and repeat. AI detectors are useless. The AIs are training on human writing, so they write fundamentally like humans. How is this not obvious?

OpenAI announced that they had started on an AI text detector and then gave up as the problem appears to be unsolvable. The machine creates statistically probable text from the input, applying statistics to the generated result will show nothing more than exactly that. You’re then left triggering false positives on text that is the most likely which makes the whole thing useless.

> OpenAI announced that they had started on an AI text detector and then gave up as the problem appears to be unsolvable.

Making a reliable LLM also appears to be unsolvable, but we still work at it and still use the current wonky iterations. My comment is even if there is no perfect AI detectors, a lot of these tools are good enough for a "first pass"--coincidentally the same use case many effective LLM practitioners use LLMs for.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#65

Post by portaouflop »

perihelions wrote: post #40
emiliobumachar wrote: post #9

Startup idea: online text editor that logs every keystroke and blockchains a hash of all logs every day. If you're accused of AI use, you can pull up the whole painstaking writing process and prove it's real.

That's a dehumanizing system. Have we lost our way, HN? Are we so immersed in the bleakness of tech, it comes so naturally for us, to propose "hey, let's create surveillance machines to perpetually watch people working, for the rest of their productive lives" and it's something we have to pause and think about? Let's not build Hell on Earth for whatever reason it momentarily seems to make business sense.

Wait so you are saying Hell on Earth would be good for business?

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#66

Post by squircle »

immibis wrote: post #49
squircle wrote: post #33

This content may violate our usage policies. Shit. Let me try this again... On the plus side, once humanity completely loses faith in the perceived value of AI, we will no doubt (I hope) wake up and realize the value of true human connection--unplug ourselves from this awful beast, and begin to rediscover what it means to be human.

"I'm sorry, but I am unable to comply with that request": https://suno.com/song/50291ff1-f971-4bff-b10e-fd168161cf3c

Ha!

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#67

Post by SkyBelow »

emiliobumachar wrote: post #9

Startup idea: online text editor that logs every keystroke and blockchains a hash of all logs every day. If you're accused of AI use, you can pull up the whole painstaking writing process and prove it's real.

If you are accused of using AI, is proving you different really a defense? It changes the trespass from making something using AI to making something that looks like AI was used, but with the extent that some subcultures are against the use of AI, just appearing to have used it even with proof you didn't isn't going to be accepted.

So much of the discussion focuses on the creators of works, but what about the changes in consumers, who seem to be splitting between those who don't mind AI and those who want to oppose anything involving AI (including merely looking like AI). Is there enough consumers in the group that opposes AI but is okay with AI looking content as long as it is proven not to be AI?

"AI looking content" would be decided on an individual by individual basis, with some percentage using AI detection software in their decision making process, with that software being varying degrees of snake oil.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#69

Post by moduspol »

meowface wrote: post #18
emiliobumachar wrote: post #9

Startup idea: online text editor that logs every keystroke and blockchains a hash of all logs every day. If you're accused of AI use, you can pull up the whole painstaking writing process and prove it's real.

There's no doubt you can write a wrapper for an LLM that can realistically mimic the same process. Cat-and-mouse isn't the answer, here.

Or just have an LLM generate it in a separate window and type it in yourself. No special tech required.

Re: AI Detectors Get It Wrong. Writers Are Being Fired Anyway

#70

Post by retrac98 »

amonith wrote: post #63
retrac98 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the AI writing is good, you’re not going to know it’s written by AI and you’ll continue to think you "can always tell" while more and more of what you read isn’t written by humans.

Yeah but to reach that point you will probably need those "useless AI detectors" (as stated by the comment I was replying to). That was my point - we're not there yet therefore those tools can be useful.

But how do you know we’re not there yet? Not across the board, but isn’t it possible there’s a small yet growing portion of written content online that’s AI generated with no obvious tells?
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