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Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

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Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#61

Post by threeseed »

nox101 wrote: post #49
steve1977 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you know these restrictions when you buy the device. Same with the Apple ecosystem. So why make it illegal?

Because it's slowing killing the the environment for kids to learn. Parents give kids an iPad, they don't give them a notebook. Kid has hands tied for really exploring programming. I'd be willing to bet if the same restrictions were in place in the 80s and 90s that 30-50% of the people who are programmers today wouldn't be programmers because they'd never have gotten started.

There are many excellent web based programming environments that cater for beginners.

As someone who was learning how to develop in the 80s your comment is hilariously ridiculous. It is 1000x easier to learn now with the wealth of tooling, content, AI assistants etc than it was for me trying to learn C++ on a Mac Plus with no internet.

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#62

Post by threeseed »

franga2000 wrote: post #31
steve1977 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you know these restrictions when you buy the device. Same with the Apple ecosystem. So why make it illegal?

Because it's an artificial limitation to make the company more money, at the expense of customer experience and the environment (yes, locked-down hardware is also a sustainability issue!). Ideally, companies would exist to serve the public and so such selfish anti-consumer behaviour would be illegal. Unfortunately, they don't and current law seems to affirm that.

But the problem is that Apple doesn't want the iPad to be a regular computer.

That's the entire value proposition of the device.

And every advanced, niche feature they add dilutes this.

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#63

Post by helpfulContrib »

watermelon0 wrote: post #6

Every time I see something like this, I'm a bit sad, that we live in a world where tablets (especially iPad M4) have comparable performance to most laptops, but we still cannot run a general purpose OS (macOS/Linux/Windows) on them. Tablets are surely capable of running VSCode, Docker, VMs, etc. locally, and from UX standpoint, VSCode is basically Chromium, so experience would be the same if these tools ran directly…

[dead]

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#64

Post by nicoburns »

watermelon0 wrote: post #6

Every time I see something like this, I'm a bit sad, that we live in a world where tablets (especially iPad M4) have comparable performance to most laptops, but we still cannot run a general purpose OS (macOS/Linux/Windows) on them. Tablets are surely capable of running VSCode, Docker, VMs, etc. locally, and from UX standpoint, VSCode is basically Chromium, so experience would be the same if these tools ran directly…

It boggles my mind that Apple don't release an iPad that runs macOS. It would sell like hotcakes. And with the M series chips they have already developed the technology to have multiple securely segregated OS's on the same device (so they could have it run iPad OS too if they wanted to).

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#65

Post by nicoburns »

can16358p wrote: post #43
infotainment wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed; Apple’s restrictions on the iPad should be illegal, IMO. It’s ridiculous how crippled they are, and all in the name of making sure people feel compelled to also buy a laptop.

I get your point, especially given the enormous power of the hardware and capabilities, but there is no surprise here: their hardware, their software, and you know what you are buying (it's not like it was open then it was remotely locked down) so everyone agreed at the time of purchase. What part of this can be made illegal?

Anything can be made illegal. I agree it's tricky to create a general rule here. My suggestion would be to require bootloaders to be unlocked such that custom operating systems can be installed on it (and yes this could apply to smart TVs, games consoles, etc too).

That wouldn't get it us macOS, but it would get us Linux and incentivise Apple to provide macOS too.

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#66

Post by euroderf »

franga2000 wrote: post #31
steve1977 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you know these restrictions when you buy the device. Same with the Apple ecosystem. So why make it illegal?

Because it's an artificial limitation to make the company more money, at the expense of customer experience and the environment (yes, locked-down hardware is also a sustainability issue!). Ideally, companies would exist to serve the public and so such selfish anti-consumer behaviour would be illegal. Unfortunately, they don't and current law seems to affirm that.

> Because it's an artificial limitation to make the company more money

Market Segmentation 101.

Even back in VCR days the el-cheapos would let you set (say) 4 recordings, the mid-range 8, and the high-end 16. All the manufacturers did was tie down pins.

Hobbled hardware is a (dis)honorable tradition in tech.

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#67

Post by panzerboiler »

miohtama wrote: post #55

Related: I tried to use Github Codespaces (Visual Studio in cloud) on iPad with a keyboard, using a browser. It works very well, in theory. There is only a slight deal breaker bug. Safari does not properly support clipboard. So copy-paste does not work. It should be very simple to fix as Chrome, Firefox, do on desktop if Safari would care more about web standards. Also you cannot install any other browser in iPad tha…

Can you describe the issue with copy/pasting in Safari? What is not supported exactly?

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#68

Post by scarface_74 »

infotainment wrote: post #12
watermelon0 wrote: post #6

Every time I see something like this, I'm a bit sad, that we live in a world where tablets (especially iPad M4) have comparable performance to most laptops, but we still cannot run a general purpose OS (macOS/Linux/Windows) on them. Tablets are surely capable of running VSCode, Docker, VMs, etc. locally, and from UX standpoint, VSCode is basically Chromium, so experience would be the same if these tools ran directly…

Agreed; Apple’s restrictions on the iPad should be illegal, IMO. It’s ridiculous how crippled they are, and all in the name of making sure people feel compelled to also buy a laptop.

So should it also be illegal for game consoles not to run a general purpose OS? The Apple displays also run a version of iOS, should it also be illegal for them not to run full versions of iOS?

I have some sympathy for the argument about side loading, the inability to have alternate app stores etc and the things that the EU is addressing haphardly.

But saying the government should mandate that Apple must support MacOS on iPads is a bridge too far.

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#69

Post by scarface_74 »

franga2000 wrote: post #60
mosselman wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d also like to be able to run anything on an iPad. But I know I can’t so I don’t buy it. I find this notion that companies should do what we want ridiculous. You know the features and capabilities upfront or you can at least and then you can decide to buy or not.

There are many problems with the "just don't buy it" argument. Mainly, that often times, the alternatives have huge unrelated down-sides. Apple makes the best tablet hardware by a large margin, but it's totally locked down. If I want a good tablet, I have bo real alternatives.

So even though as a user you have alternatives, you don’t want to buy one of those alternatives so Apple should make exactly what you personally want?

Re: Run VSCode and terminal on any iOS device

#70

Post by scarface_74 »

nox101 wrote: post #49
steve1977 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you know these restrictions when you buy the device. Same with the Apple ecosystem. So why make it illegal?

Because it's slowing killing the the environment for kids to learn. Parents give kids an iPad, they don't give them a notebook. Kid has hands tied for really exploring programming. I'd be willing to bet if the same restrictions were in place in the 80s and 90s that 30-50% of the people who are programmers today wouldn't be programmers because they'd never have gotten started.

In the 80s and 90s there were locked down devices - game consoles - and computers.
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