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iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

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Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#61

Post by bangaladore »

I'd suggest everyone go read the issue thread (https://gitlab.com/gnachman/iterm2/-/issues/11470) before commenting.

It seems abundantly clear that people are being overly negative about a feature that realistically has no security concerns (even as originally developed). Many commenters did not even know how the feature worked (assumed all keystrokes were being sent by default, etc...)

One outright said that the feature should be removed because the developer must "stand against OpenAI and the whole "AI" industry."

To me this just seems like a lot of people whining and trying to inject politics and unfounded safety concerns into a good implementation of something that many people like. This is an opt-in feature. It has a separate panel to even interact with it. And you need to provide a valid openai API key to use it.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#62

Post by nimih »

jedberg wrote: post #19
janice1999 wrote: post #10

I'm not an iTerm2 user and the attitude of the developer in the response has certainly convinced me to never become one. I understand open source developers get burnt out, particularly with backlash from demanding users who contribute nothing in return, but the contempt for users with very valid concerns about AI and data leaks is not a healthy sign.

Their concerns aren't really valid. It's an entirely optional feature. There is no functional difference between being in the core and being a plugin. Someone who wants to violate exfiltration policies can still do so with maybe one extra step.

Right, there's no functional difference, but there certainly is a social and organizational difference: if a feature is provided as a plug-in, it makes it somewhat more difficult (and, importantly, clearly signals to the user that this is the case) for default-off to turn into default-on, or for optional to turn into required, neither of which is unheard of in modern software development.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#63

Post by notatoad »

irskep wrote: post #21
alex_suzuki wrote: post #6

The comment for the change contains a note of bitterness: > I have two goals in this change: To allow developers in restrictive but technically incompetent organizations to continue to use iTerm2. That is, they disallow anything that could potentially exfiltrate data, but don't have their act together enough to implement MDM. So that people who hate AI can feel at ease that no AI will happen by accident without havin…

Those words were definitely written through gritted teeth, but it seems to me he's being very literal. The second point in particular is exactly what the anti-AI-feature people seem to be asking for (and they are reasonable for asking for it).

> and they are reasonable for asking for it

are they? their position is basically that they don't trust iterm2 to work properly, but only in regard to this specific setting.

if you don't trust iterm2 to work, don't use it. if you do trust it to work, you should be able to trust that the ai feature that's off by default won't magically turn itself on.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#64

Post by Suzuran »

vasachi wrote: post #24
atkailash wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. You have to provide it your own API key. If you don’t want it, don’t put it in and bam, no problem

Say they introduce a bug, that will try to call that API even when there is no key.

This is what was claimed was happening. I received multiple warnings that iTerm2 was sending "all terminal interactions" to OpenAI's servers regardless of the absence of an API key. Packet captures showing "exfiltrated" data were represented as proof when those were created with an invalid API key, not a blank API key.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#65

Post by artimaeis »

akira2501 wrote: post #38
Cu3PO42 wrote: post #22

I feel really sorry for the developer. I've only been a casual observer, but from my view point the community's reaction was... not great, to put it lightly. I get that a lot of us are tired of 'AI' being shoved down our throat at every possible turn. I get that a lot of us have privacy concerns. I get that maybe you don't want it in your terminal emulator. But iTerm is a free (both as in gratis and as in libre) open…

[flagged]

It's been in beta for a year. There's been plenty of community discussion in that time, mostly around testing the feature. It was only after the release that all this outrage happened.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#66

Post by weinzierl »

jedberg wrote: post #19
janice1999 wrote: post #10

I'm not an iTerm2 user and the attitude of the developer in the response has certainly convinced me to never become one. I understand open source developers get burnt out, particularly with backlash from demanding users who contribute nothing in return, but the contempt for users with very valid concerns about AI and data leaks is not a healthy sign.

Their concerns aren't really valid. It's an entirely optional feature. There is no functional difference between being in the core and being a plugin. Someone who wants to violate exfiltration policies can still do so with maybe one extra step.

On a technical level there is no relevant difference but on a social level there well is, in my opinion.

The expectation is that plugins need to be activated explicitly and that do not get installed or activated automatically. Even stronger, a common impression about plugins is, that they are often a pain to install and get working. I know that this expectation has been violated occasionally in one form or another but I doubt that many people are aware of that or could even come up with examples.

Built-in features on the other hand are completely different. The usual experience is they get moved around, enabled, disabled willy nilly without notification or consent with every (unrelated) update. iTerm2 is not like that and George has done a fantastic job to build a ton of trust over decades, but I don't blame anyone not knowing that and being cautious.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#67

Post by glhaynes »

rottencupcakes wrote: post #34
irskep wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those words were definitely written through gritted teeth, but it seems to me he's being very literal. The second point in particular is exactly what the anti-AI-feature people seem to be asking for (and they are reasonable for asking for it).

AI is acting as a catalyst here to get people into flame war mode. The issue here is the existence of a terminal feature that can send your commands to a 3rd party server. It could have no AI whatsoever; it is reasonable to not want this in an app that you might paste secret keys into. Do the people who don’t like this feature have the same standards for ever app they use? Probably not, they’re probably being a littl…

The issue here is the existence of a terminal feature that can send your commands to a 3rd party server.

With not many more characters than are needed for an API key, I could write a script in the very terminal provided by iTerm2 that sends all my commands to a 3rd party server!

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#68

Post by add-sub-mul-div »

lxe wrote: post #4

It was never really a case of "AI shoved down our throats" anyways. People just assumed it was and got their pitchforks and torches out. The feature was always opt-in. I'm sorry gnachman had to endure this nonsense.

Outside this bubble here, AI (in its most recent form) is pretty unpopular. No one wants a tool they like to be associated with this just like it would be annoying to start seeing ads in it.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#69

Post by moomoo11 »

Cu3PO42 wrote: post #22

I feel really sorry for the developer. I've only been a casual observer, but from my view point the community's reaction was... not great, to put it lightly. I get that a lot of us are tired of 'AI' being shoved down our throat at every possible turn. I get that a lot of us have privacy concerns. I get that maybe you don't want it in your terminal emulator. But iTerm is a free (both as in gratis and as in libre) open…

There was a highly upvoted article on here yesterday.

Honestly I agree with their sentiments. iTerm should be a terminal app. Any of this stuff should be an extension/plugin, and not a core feature.

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