Dealing with Wrist Pain • Hacker News Board

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#61

Post by polyfractal » Wed, May 30, 2012, 1:19 PM UTC

gallerytungsten wrote: post #56

steve8918 wrote: post #12

I've found that the biggest reason for neck and wrist pain is actually the mouse. The position that most people use the mouse, off to the right side (if you're right-handed), causes your arm and your hand to twist unnaturally, since it needs to be flat to the table. This puts pressure on the nerves running down your arm, and for me, this is what caused the most amount of pain, to the point where I was worried my care…

Indeed, it's the mouse's fault. I switched to a trackball years ago and it's a vast improvement. Best one I've found so far is the Kensington "expert mouse" which has a wrist rest attached at the front.

Everyone thinks I'm crazy, but I still prefer to use a trackball as well. Particularly the "Microsoft Trackball Explorer", which unfortunately is no longer in production (so I'm treating mine like a prince so it never breaks)

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#62

Post by jonstjohn » Wed, May 30, 2012, 1:37 PM UTC

steve8918 wrote: post #12

I've found that the biggest reason for neck and wrist pain is actually the mouse. The position that most people use the mouse, off to the right side (if you're right-handed), causes your arm and your hand to twist unnaturally, since it needs to be flat to the table. This puts pressure on the nerves running down your arm, and for me, this is what caused the most amount of pain, to the point where I was worried my care…

I use a left-handed Evoluent mouse, even though I used a right-handed mouse for years (funny enough, I'm actually left handed but it still took some getting used to). This made a huge difference when I was developing some issues in my right hand years ago. I also have a track ball that I used to rotate in occasionally, although I haven't needed it for a long time.

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#63

Post by jonstjohn » Wed, May 30, 2012, 1:42 PM UTC

One thing that people overlook when trying to improve their work ergonomics is where they are resting their hands and elbows. You can subtly pinch the nerves in both your hands and elbows leading to restricted blood flow and eventually pain or numbness.

I had pain/numbness in my ring and pinky fingers a few years ago that was progressively getting worse. I switched to a Kinesis Advantage keyboard and left-handed mouse but only saw modest improvements. It was only after nearly a year that I realized that I had been resting my elbows on my chair all day, and that was pinching my ulnar nerve and restricting blood flow. After lowering my elbow rests, I saw an dramatic improvement within weeks. Today I have zero issues.

I never saw a professional, but may have saved myself a lot of pain and worry if I had.

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#64

Post by snowwrestler » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:00 PM UTC

I solved my wrist pain by doing two things.

1) I switched from a mouse to a trackpad. On my PC I have an old Fingerworks trackpad I got off eBay, and on my Mac I have a Magic Trackpad from Apple. The trackpad allows me to completely relax my hand between my use of the pointer--which is most of the time. When I do move the pointer, and click, I can do it with a single semi-relaxed finger. Whereas a mouse, or even a trackball, required me to hold most of my hand in tension to move or click. On the trackpad I exclusively use tap-to-click...mechanical buttons are bad for fingers and wrists because they require a lot more force.

2) I go kayaking regularly. Gripping and manipulating the paddle gives my wrist and fingers a low-impact workout through a wide range of motion. It helps keep the muscles and tendons healthy. Plus being healthy in general helps improve almost any physical ailment.

Edit to add: With the trackpads I have had to train myself to let my right hand completely relax when I'm not pointing the mouse. When I started trying to pay close attention to my right hand, I realized that I was holding it in tension most of the time even when sitting back--sort of anticipating the next mouse usage. I've had to consciously focus on completely relaxing it whenever I'm not mousing or typing.

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#65

Post by muxxa » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:04 PM UTC

Nobody here has mentioned stress.

I suffered from a lot of wrist pain (RSI) for a number of years, tried everything including alternative keyboards and trackball mice. The only physical 'device' that improved things was getting a proper chair with actual armrests (which I assumed would make things worse by constricting arm movement).

When I read an article mentioning a book called 'The Mind Body Problem' (I didn't actually read the book), the penny dropped.

My mental state of agitation, of needing to 'get shit done' was translating into increased tension in my wrists. Just recognizing this has pretty much solved my RSI problems (going strong for over a year). This explains why some people can work on laptops etc. in the most contorted positions without ever having any adverse physical effects - they are not under any mental stress.

[1] http://www.bookdepository.co.uk/Mind-Body-Problem-Rebecca-Go...

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#66

Post by mtrimpe » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:13 PM UTC

gallerytungsten wrote: post #56

steve8918 wrote: post #12

I've found that the biggest reason for neck and wrist pain is actually the mouse. The position that most people use the mouse, off to the right side (if you're right-handed), causes your arm and your hand to twist unnaturally, since it needs to be flat to the table. This puts pressure on the nerves running down your arm, and for me, this is what caused the most amount of pain, to the point where I was worried my care…

Indeed, it's the mouse's fault. I switched to a trackball years ago and it's a vast improvement. Best one I've found so far is the Kensington "expert mouse" which has a wrist rest attached at the front.

Another option which has worked wonders for me is the RollerMouse.

You just use your thumbs to move the bar around without ever taking your hands off the keyboard. It's a bit awkward at first, but you get used to it quite fast.

[see http://ergo.contour-design.com/]

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#67

Post by president » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:22 PM UTC

stuaxo wrote: post #49

This will seem really wack... however: I saw some youtube videos of Dr Sarno [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_E._Sarno ] and read some testimonials on his technique. At that point I could change the pain in my wrists into a feeling of anxiety in my chest. I then bought the book (this step isn't nessacary) - "The Mind Body Experience), and now when I get pain I can sort of concentrate on the area it happens and it…

I read about Sarno on HN a while back and can vouch for its weirdness but also success. Like you, I didn't read the book, just read some of his core theories on the web. All I did was stop thinking about the pain and it actually worked. It's like a placebo of some sort.

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#68

Post by jostylr » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:32 PM UTC

Treating trigger points saved me. I had terrible wrist pain and then I read about trigger points. I found some in my upper arms, massaged them out over a few days, and the pain was gone. Look for spots painful under a little pressure, massage it for 20 seconds. Repeat several times for a few days. Done.

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#69

Post by mr_donk » Wed, May 30, 2012, 2:38 PM UTC

stuaxo wrote: post #49

This will seem really wack... however: I saw some youtube videos of Dr Sarno [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_E._Sarno ] and read some testimonials on his technique. At that point I could change the pain in my wrists into a feeling of anxiety in my chest. I then bought the book (this step isn't nessacary) - "The Mind Body Experience), and now when I get pain I can sort of concentrate on the area it happens and it…

The book is actually The Mindbody Prescription.

This cured me of 3 years of horrible RSI pain. I did go to Doctors, physiotherapists, chiropractors and acupuncturists and had anti-inflammatory creams, you name it. Nothing worked for more than a couple days... and this was a last resort. I wish I would have tried it sooner, but I doubt I would have given it a shot if I wasn't desperate.

Read this for a well written account from a hacker: http://aaroniba.net/articles/tmp/how-i-cured-my-rsi-pain.htm...

Then buy the book and read it. It'll cost you less than an MS Natural Keyboard, not to mention all the other crap (wrist braces, heating pads, etc etc).

Re: Dealing with Wrist Pain

#70

Post by ryan-c » Wed, May 30, 2012, 7:54 PM UTC

__alexs wrote: post #29

steve8918 wrote: post #12

I've found that the biggest reason for neck and wrist pain is actually the mouse. The position that most people use the mouse, off to the right side (if you're right-handed), causes your arm and your hand to twist unnaturally, since it needs to be flat to the table. This puts pressure on the nerves running down your arm, and for me, this is what caused the most amount of pain, to the point where I was worried my care…

+1 to mice being evil. I'm not convinced by ergonomic mice despite having used one for the past 4-5 years. They are less painful to use but I find they just hide the problem. Using any normal mouse these days becomes painful within a couple of hours for me. Instead I use a Trackpoint basically all the time now. I have ThinkPads at home and a MacBook Pro with one of these http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-ThinkPad-Travel…

I actually hacked a Trackpoint into my Kinesis this past weekend - hopefully it won't take me too long to adjust. I still haven't figured out a great solution to clicking - at the moment I have the right control key mapped to a click using mousekeys (linux), but I don't have a good way to right click.

http://i.imgur.com/q6AQG.jpg