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Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

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Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#61

Post by lxgr »

kaszanka wrote: post #58
lxgr wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Using a phone to pay for stuff is an opsec nightmare Do you mean "privacy nightmare"? Security-wise, Google Pay beats using your physical card since it uses a device-specific number that can't be skimmed by terminals and reused online. > the custom rom is still far more valuable from a security perspective than bending the knee to some bespoke ecosystem payment app (especially if you have an older device.) I'd argu…

AFAIK it only beats magnetic stripe cards, not EMV chip cards

EMV chip cards still contain your card number and expiry date.

Skimmers would need a way to also learn the CVC2 from the back of the card to use it at most (but not all!) online merchants, but that's feasible using a small camera or a waiter/cashier accomplice doing the skimming.

With Google Pay and Apple Pay, and similar mobile wallets, that number is never shared during payments (and in fact not even stored on the device).

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#63

Post by Rinzler89 »

skinner927 wrote: post #42
HansHamster wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean Microsoft Windows which dropped support for Zen 1 with Win11 not even 5 years after Zen 1 was released? Meanwhile, Linux will still run on a 30+ year old CPU...

They said software support, not hardware support. You can take a win 95 gui app and run it on windows 10 without issue. You can’t do the same on Linux.

Pretty much.

For the sake of nostalgia, I downloaded an Encarta 2000 ISO form Internet Archive, then spun up a Windows 98 VM to run it on but that VM had a lot of sound issues in Virtual Box, then I realized that Encarta would also run just fine installed on Windows 11 lol.

This kind of backwards compatibility is not something I need on a daily basis but it's pretty neat that I can just run very old SW on my main OS without fiddling with VMs.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#64

Post by jjmarr »

nimbius wrote: post #52
sn0wtrooper wrote: post #9

Long is gone the time where unlocking bootloaders and installing custom ROMs was the best path to follow. Even if you are able to unlock it (with difficulties such as this one, or others that involve opening the device and soldering a shortcut), you will have a device where apps check for unlocked bootloaders and rooted OS, and forbid you from use the application.

the only app ive seen balk at bootloader status (to date) is google wallet. Using a phone to pay for stuff is an opsec nightmare youd only entertain so long as becoming an integrated and saleable asset in a data brokers portfolio is a life goal. 'pm uninstall' and move on, the custom rom is still far more valuable from a security perspective than bending the knee to some bespoke ecosystem payment app (especially if y…

I'm in Canada and I can literally just tap the card itself on the reader. Every card has this ability and it can't be skimmed.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#65

Post by onli »

zamalek wrote: post #55
freedomben wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All pixel phones are very easy to unlock the bootloader, and Google publishes factory images. So if your root goes wrong or you need to revert to stock, it is very easy. The actual process of obtaining root is as easy as it is on any other device, which is to say, I wish it was a lot easier, but it is very doable. As a bonus, it also opens the door for Graphene OS should you choose to go that direction.

Pixels can also be re-locked with a custom ROM present (I think Graphene is the only one that does this, though). For that reason alone I'll be transitioning back to Pixel (once this phone is beyond help).

CalxyOS is the other one, with less problematic developer history.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#66

Post by paulryanrogers »

nimbius wrote: post #52
sn0wtrooper wrote: post #9

Long is gone the time where unlocking bootloaders and installing custom ROMs was the best path to follow. Even if you are able to unlock it (with difficulties such as this one, or others that involve opening the device and soldering a shortcut), you will have a device where apps check for unlocked bootloaders and rooted OS, and forbid you from use the application.

the only app ive seen balk at bootloader status (to date) is google wallet. Using a phone to pay for stuff is an opsec nightmare youd only entertain so long as becoming an integrated and saleable asset in a data brokers portfolio is a life goal. 'pm uninstall' and move on, the custom rom is still far more valuable from a security perspective than bending the knee to some bespoke ecosystem payment app (especially if y…

Bank apps, Netflix, and Disney+ also won't work. There are spoofing measures though I've been burned by unlocking and rooting too often to try again, at least not while my devices are still under warranty.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#67

Post by dns_snek »

esalman wrote: post #4
Rinzler89 wrote: post #2

>Given that ASUS has one of the worst software support commitments in the Android world [...] It started removing posts about bootloader unlocking in its ZenTalk forums. Which is why I never understood why Asus Zenfone kept being recommended on HN all the time when people asked for good android phones to buy. I thought this community appreciated long SW support. I think the people recommending it were not dogfooding…

Tbh I don't share the sentiment that the community appreciates long SW support. Otherwise we'd see Windows being recommended over Linux more often.

It's really not the same kind of support. We get plenty of active support and development in the Linux world, and open source more broadly.

Windows only offers essential life support, trying to ensure that something written 20 years ago still runs today, despite being completely abandoned for 19 years with no reasonable way of fixing it.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#68

Post by jjmarr »

lxgr wrote: post #61
kaszanka wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK it only beats magnetic stripe cards, not EMV chip cards

EMV chip cards still contain your card number and expiry date. Skimmers would need a way to also learn the CVC2 from the back of the card to use it at most (but not all!) online merchants, but that's feasible using a small camera or a waiter/cashier accomplice doing the skimming. With Google Pay and Apple Pay, and similar mobile wallets, that number is never shared during payments (and in fact not even stored on the…

They do, but you can't get the card number from reading the chip. The protocol is a challenge-response one based on a private key stored within the chip.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chip_Authentication_Program

You need to read the entire card number + cvc2 + expiry date with your camera. That's not skimming, that's just taking a photo of the card.

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#69

Post by pohuing »

cbarrick wrote: post #49
Rinzler89 wrote: post #2

>Given that ASUS has one of the worst software support commitments in the Android world [...] It started removing posts about bootloader unlocking in its ZenTalk forums. Which is why I never understood why Asus Zenfone kept being recommended on HN all the time when people asked for good android phones to buy. I thought this community appreciated long SW support. I think the people recommending it were not dogfooding…

Honestly, I switched from Pixel to Zenfone for the form factor. Ever since the visor redesign with the Pixel 6, the Pixel series has been too big for my hands. I do miss the great Pixel software though...

Same thing here. Zenfone android is similar to pixel android while I find Samsung's android insanely ugly. I just miss some of the Google app integrations

Re: Asus refunds Zenfone buyer for failing to provide bootloader unlock tools

#70

Post by j-bos »

onli wrote: post #65
zamalek wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pixels can also be re-locked with a custom ROM present (I think Graphene is the only one that does this, though). For that reason alone I'll be transitioning back to Pixel (once this phone is beyond help).

CalxyOS is the other one, with less problematic developer history.

What are the history problems with graphene?
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