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Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

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Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How much meaningful and interesting work do you think exists in this world? If you're willing to take a salary cut, lots.

Depends on your definition of meaningful and interesting. I have no doubt that public school teaching, working in a nursing home, working as a social worker is meaningful, but I wouldn’t find any of those to be interesting.

Who said anything about any of those jobs?

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#62
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although it is pretty strong evidence office space is a boondoggle. That’s a lot of pointless overhead costs that hurt the bottom line. I like seeing my peers in person. I like hashing things out in person. Apparently that’s a waste of time and money.

that’s just fine and good for you, but please don’t impose your preferences on the rest of us.

Why not? Companies will eventually sort into ones where likeminded people are together. Some will be more friendly to remote than others. If I want to work in person with people, I’ll join a company that agrees. If someone wants to be remote, they might have to join a different company.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#63

Most employees can screw around websurfing or shopping just as well at work as at home. They mostly do it because they are bored. Give them interesting, meaningful work and they will be productive.

Or, give them real equity.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Water cooler chat used to be the big thing when I worked in an office.

I’ve worked in an office for over 25 years. I’ve never chatted with anyone at the water cooler (those, these days it is a water dispenser machine that can dispense cold or hot still water or sparkling water). I assume this water cooler chat thing must be from farther back in time.

Water cooler chat doesn’t need to involve a literal water cooler. It’s an expression for the casual chit-chat that occurs when you encounter someone in the hallway.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To put it pithily: it uses proxies of both dependent and independent variables, which increases the noise of both, in a study to determine signal-to-noise ratio.

Which proxies do you think are bad / why? The moment you go more coarse than documenting every single worker's perfect timesheet and working out their direct individual output, you're introducing some kind of proxy. What you wrote applies to every economics statistical analysis so far.

> The researchers examined productivity trends in 43 industries — including chemical manufacturing, retail trade, and accommodation and food services — and assigned a “teleworkability” score based on the occupational mix of each industry and the share of jobs that can be done remotely.

They never actually measured the amount of work hours being done remotely. They never measured the number of employees working remotely. They just had some guy make up "remote-ability" numbers for each sector and then carefully pretended to be doing science. Meanwhile all these sectors have seen unrelated changes to operating environment that have not been controlled for. It's BS on BS on BS.

Overall I am not even convinced their remote work metric would correlate with hours worked remotely.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#66

As a Tech PM, I can say,remote work definitely increases productivity. I noticed, employees tend to work more when diligently when they were allowed to work remotely. In case of complex Troubleshooting, this is definitely an added advantage , as people can focus more and solve these issues comfortably.

I know I am more productive for sure. I started working remotely in 2017, but I wasn't allowed to jump right into it. I had an agreement with my manager and I started doing one day remote a week, then two, and eventually built up to fully remote, and eventually even working remotely from all over the world. But it wasn't overnight, I had to build that trust.

I honestly got a little nervous when everyone started working from home suddenly. I think everyone that can, should have the option, but some people just don't have the discipline or haven't learned it yet. I know this because another person on my team wanted to emulate my success (pre-COVID) and blew it and proved they couldn't get work done outside the office.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#67
post #44

> If remote work boosts productivity in a substantial way, then it should improve productivity performance Not necessarily given the methodology. For example, if remote work allows a worker to do their laundry in parallel where they would be otherwise unable to in an office, their productivity has increased, but the gains would not show up in the study. It observes industry productivity, not work productivity.

Although it is pretty strong evidence office space is a boondoggle. That’s a lot of pointless overhead costs that hurt the bottom line. I like seeing my peers in person. I like hashing things out in person. Apparently that’s a waste of time and money.

> That’s a lot of pointless overhead costs that hurt the bottom line.

Or put the other way: Remote work let's the employee pay for the office space.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#68
People are different. For some it really increases productivity and wellbeing. For others the opposite. I'm not surprised it is about the same on average as measured by work output.

I've been working 100% remote since 2017 and I'll never willingly change it.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#69
post #48

This is not what I want to happen, but I have to think the American tech worker gets screwed in the world where remote work is the norm. If you make the labor market global, there's a lot of really smart Europeans who will work for half or a third of what American devs will. Can anyone refute this line of thinking? I'd love to be wrong.

1. Labor law is local. This adds (on a per-country basis) legal risk and compliance costs, as well as operational costs (e.g., you might need to have specific policies that apply to employees in specific countries).

2. Taxation regimes. These too vary by country, and add compliance and operational costs.

3. Other laws (both U.S. and foreign) that make hiring foreign nationals complex in certain situations, e.g., ITAR.

When considered together, these costs and operational obstacles can be significant.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#70
post #48

This is not what I want to happen, but I have to think the American tech worker gets screwed in the world where remote work is the norm. If you make the labor market global, there's a lot of really smart Europeans who will work for half or a third of what American devs will. Can anyone refute this line of thinking? I'd love to be wrong.

We started down this path before COVID, it's just accelerating now.

I think language, accents[0], time zones, and culture are the main things providing any resistance to this happening even quicker than it should.

[0]We once had a person on our team from India, sharp guy but his accent was extremely difficult to parse over audio. We ended up doing most communication over email and chat.

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