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Modeless Vim

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Re: Modeless Vim

#61
This reading this for me is like watching someone order eggs sunny-side up but then they scope out the yokes and toss them; eating only the egg whites.

Similes and feels aside, I wonder which situations using vim in this way comes up that you wouldn't just use your preferred editor for. I know you can set an editor for things like git, but couldn't you use a GUI editor?

Re: Modeless Vim

#62
post #37

Conceptually the reasons the author give for this (syntax highlighting and other features of vim outclass other terminal-based editors) make total sense. That said there's something absolutely defiling about this. It's like installing a V8 in a Tesla, or replacing the pumpkin in pumpkin pie. I love that it will make VIM more accessible for more people, but I hate how they do it. Kudos to the author.

> It's like installing a V8 in a Tesla, or replacing the pumpkin in pumpkin pie. Most pumpkin pies are actually made with butternut squash and other similar squashes, not pumpkin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cucurbita_moschata https://www.thekitchn.com/whats-actually-in-your-canned-pump...

Not sure about where you’re from but where I’m from, you don’t make pumpkin pie from a can. You make it with pumpkin purée. From scratch. Get out of here with your non-pumpkin pumpkin pie propaganda.

Some pumpkin, blended into a paste, some brown sugar, an egg or two, some heavy cream and some cinnamon and crushed cloves and you have your pie filling.

Re: Modeless Vim

#63
post #42

I attempted this within a few days of first being exposed to vi - 35 years ago. But since I was logging into different machines all the time I soon decided it was better to just use vi the way it came out of the box, modes and all. That philosophy has served me well over the years.

Do you remember which plugin/project you used at the time? The one being linked looks pretty recent [1]. Are there any other implementations?

[1]: https://github.com/SebastianMuskalla/ModelessVim/blob/main/L...

Re: Modeless Vim

#64
I currently use vim every day. I have been trying to learn vim off and on for about 30 years.

vi and vim have modes because they were created in an era where computing and terminal capabilities were very limited and even when the terminals could support interactive editing, it wasn't expected. They had very low expectations. They were used to things like 'ed'.

The religious beliefs that programmers have about vim are a case study in why I believe that AI will easily take control of the planet in less than a century.

That sentence is questionable in multiple ways.

Anyway, I will definitely try this thing out. Hopefully I am not too lazy to keep installing it. That's what happened with the last one of these.

Re: Modeless Vim

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's like installing a V8 in a Tesla, or replacing the pumpkin in pumpkin pie. Most pumpkin pies are actually made with butternut squash and other similar squashes, not pumpkin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cucurbita_moschata https://www.thekitchn.com/whats-actually-in-your-canned-pump...

Not sure about where you’re from but where I’m from, you don’t make pumpkin pie from a can. You make it with pumpkin purée. From scratch. Get out of here with your non-pumpkin pumpkin pie propaganda. Some pumpkin, blended into a paste, some brown sugar, an egg or two, some heavy cream and some cinnamon and crushed cloves and you have your pie filling.

You can make it with homemade butternut squash puree too, and it will taste better because of its sweetness. Give it a try sometime.

Re: Modeless Vim

#66

This reading this for me is like watching someone order eggs sunny-side up but then they scope out the yokes and toss them; eating only the egg whites. Similes and feels aside, I wonder which situations using vim in this way comes up that you wouldn't just use your preferred editor for. I know you can set an editor for things like git, but couldn't you use a GUI editor?

Happens often when one needs to ssh into a remote server and edit some files, sometimes with tmux to boot.

Re: Modeless Vim

#67
post #43

IBM CUA I’ve always wondered how different Unix/Linux would be today if decades ago a Common User Access (standardized menu system like FILE | EDIT | etc) had been defined for TUI apps (like how it was for Windows & Mac OS). Imagine VI & EMacs having the same key bindings due to standards. https://sqlite.org/hctree/doc/hctree/doc/hctree/index.html#s...

vi and emacs are prehistoric. Folks now are ok with / and \ and maybe some can deal with : as a file separator.

But in the precambrian era you needed to know about ^ to edit a specific version of a file, because diffs were tracked.

They're both wonderful and amazing and can handle anything, because they had to handle everything when filesystems were like a brand new invention and nobody really knew what was good or bad, so they threw everything in.

Tough to get standards before standards exist.

Re: Modeless Vim

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure about where you’re from but where I’m from, you don’t make pumpkin pie from a can. You make it with pumpkin purée. From scratch. Get out of here with your non-pumpkin pumpkin pie propaganda. Some pumpkin, blended into a paste, some brown sugar, an egg or two, some heavy cream and some cinnamon and crushed cloves and you have your pie filling.

You can make it with homemade butternut squash puree too, and it will taste better because of its sweetness. Give it a try sometime.

That’s a butternut squash pie, not a pumpkin pie. ;)

Try with pumpkin, nutmeg, cinnamon, and cloves… it’s that old timer pumpkin pie taste.

Re: Modeless Vim

#69
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author answers that in the linked thing, the short of it is for the vim features that nano doesn't have.

I feel like if yiu want a fully featured IDE with language highlighting, debugging breakpoints, and code completion, but at the same time you want more ergonomic user interface, you should just use VSCode instead of doing everything in the terminal

As the author states, this is for people who do most things in a different (modal) editor and just need a terminal editor on occasion.

Re: Modeless Vim

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can make it with homemade butternut squash puree too, and it will taste better because of its sweetness. Give it a try sometime.

That’s a butternut squash pie, not a pumpkin pie. ;) Try with pumpkin, nutmeg, cinnamon, and cloves… it’s that old timer pumpkin pie taste.

Apparently coffee cake has no coffee in it so we really can’t believe anything anymore.
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