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Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

nytimes.com

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Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#61

Post by acdha »

electrondood wrote: post #53
martini333 wrote: post #14

"Owner notification letters will be mailed in accordance with 49 C.F.R. § 577.7." That's a lot of mail...

It's so stupid. Or... they could just display the change notes on the dash when they push a software update.

Here’s the actual legal requirement:

> In the case of a notification required to be sent by a motor vehicle manufacturer, by certified mail, verifiable electronic means such as receipts or logs from electronic mail or satellite distribution system, or other more expeditious and verifiable means to all dealers and distributors of the vehicles that contain the defect or noncompliance.

I think that would cover them having a pop up on the dashboard as long as they were confident that the driver couldn’t miss it and they could log that it was seen.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#62

Post by MBCook »

LordKeren wrote: post #45
cush wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because a manufacturer applies a fix OTA doesn’t make it not a recall. Recall is just a term. Regulators issue the recall. How the manufacturer performs the fix can vary.

Yeah, but it is plainly obvious that “recall” is a loaded term here. Yes, it is strictly true that it is the name for the thing that regulators are saying— But nothing is getting “recalled” in the literal meaning of the word. “Tesla ships mandatory software update OTA to address bug” is much more accurate to how this affects real people.

It is loaded. It means a critical safety issue has been found by the government and they’re forcing it to be fixed. That comes with various timeline and notification requirements.

That’s all it means.

Whether or not you have to drive to a specific building to get it done is not and never has been a requirement of the recall process. That’s just how automakers have done it, mostly out of lack of OTA and unwillingness to send techs to invidual peoples houses.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#63

Post by szundi »

csa wrote: post #47
rgbrgb wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I was wondering about that too. I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-self-driving model y. I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane). Won’t be trying again until next update (if it sticks in the car). edit: corrected autopilot (cruise control) -> self driving

Are you a new Tesla owner? > I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-autopilot model y. All (edit: new since 2019) Teslas come with autopilot. “Full self driving” is an add on. > I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane) “Switching off” usually means that it can’t identify the lane it’s sup…

Actually the name is not overdone itself, as autopilot is a simple airplane software that keeps it on a line basically. Funny how Tesla hype gave it more clever meaning.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#65

Post by reureu »

csa wrote: post #47
rgbrgb wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I was wondering about that too. I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-self-driving model y. I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane). Won’t be trying again until next update (if it sticks in the car). edit: corrected autopilot (cruise control) -> self driving

Are you a new Tesla owner? > I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-autopilot model y. All (edit: new since 2019) Teslas come with autopilot. “Full self driving” is an add on. > I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane) “Switching off” usually means that it can’t identify the lane it’s sup…

I've been driving an M3 since 2020 and have put 40k miles on it, mostly over road trips throughout California and the western half of the US.

Phantom braking has always been a bit of an issue -- when I first got the car, I just wouldn't use cruise control in heavy traffic, but felt ok using it once out of a city. In the past year or so, it's been so bad I'm scared to use it at all, and I've filed multiple complaints with the NHTSA. I'll be driving on I-80 through Nevada or Utah and every ~10 minutes the car will slam on its brakes. This is dry, consistently lit, consistent colors, minimal bridges casting shadows, etc.

I wish there was a way to make my cruise control "dumb"/non-adaptive just to stop the random abrupt braking in the middle of nowhere.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#66

Post by csa »

throwup238 wrote: post #60
csa wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you a new Tesla owner? > I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-autopilot model y. All (edit: new since 2019) Teslas come with autopilot. “Full self driving” is an add on. > I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane) “Switching off” usually means that it can’t identify the lane it’s sup…

You literally just described every defining feature of California roads.

> You literally just described every defining feature of California roads.

Eh… it has to be egregious.

I live in California, and I only have problems on two spots between Bakersfield and Barstow. The rest are literal construction sites with unmarked lanes.

Other than that, I have no issues 99% of the time I use AP when driving in NorCal in the Bay Area and surrounding areas (Napa/Sonoma to the north, Sacramento to the east, and SLO to the south). I use AP a lot, so I feel confident stating how reliable it is in these areas.

If someone finds that it doesn’t work for them in one of these areas, I’d almost guarantee that it’s in a specific spot for a specific reason.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#68

Post by peterept »

csa wrote: post #47
rgbrgb wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I was wondering about that too. I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-self-driving model y. I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane). Won’t be trying again until next update (if it sticks in the car). edit: corrected autopilot (cruise control) -> self driving

Are you a new Tesla owner? > I got a software update that seemed to add auto steer to my non-autopilot model y. All (edit: new since 2019) Teslas come with autopilot. “Full self driving” is an add on. > I tried it a few times on the highway but it seemed erratic (switching off randomly and dangerously engaging regenerative brakes in the fast lane) “Switching off” usually means that it can’t identify the lane it’s sup…

Auto-pilot is not on all Teslas as it was a paid upgrade til mid-2019. My M3 does not have auto-pilot!

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#69

Post by light_hue_1 »

MBCook wrote: post #62
LordKeren wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but it is plainly obvious that “recall” is a loaded term here. Yes, it is strictly true that it is the name for the thing that regulators are saying— But nothing is getting “recalled” in the literal meaning of the word. “Tesla ships mandatory software update OTA to address bug” is much more accurate to how this affects real people.

It is loaded. It means a critical safety issue has been found by the government and they’re forcing it to be fixed. That comes with various timeline and notification requirements. That’s all it means. Whether or not you have to drive to a specific building to get it done is not and never has been a requirement of the recall process. That’s just how automakers have done it, mostly out of lack of OTA and unwillingness…

We need a different word. This is not a recall.

Re: Tesla Recalls 2M Vehicles over Autopilot Software Issue

#70

Post by MetaWhirledPeas »

MBCook wrote: post #62
LordKeren wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but it is plainly obvious that “recall” is a loaded term here. Yes, it is strictly true that it is the name for the thing that regulators are saying— But nothing is getting “recalled” in the literal meaning of the word. “Tesla ships mandatory software update OTA to address bug” is much more accurate to how this affects real people.

It is loaded. It means a critical safety issue has been found by the government and they’re forcing it to be fixed. That comes with various timeline and notification requirements. That’s all it means. Whether or not you have to drive to a specific building to get it done is not and never has been a requirement of the recall process. That’s just how automakers have done it, mostly out of lack of OTA and unwillingness…

Words matter. "Recall" had a very specific meaning in the past before OTA updates: your vehicle was recalled to the dealership to be retrofitted for safety reasons, which is obviously very inconvenient for the owner of the vehicle. These OTA "recalls" are safety issues too, but the wording still implies the inconvenience of dropping your car off to be altered by a mechanic, which is not the case. New terminology would be preferable.
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