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Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

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Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#61

Post by tomjen3 »

safety1st wrote: post #35
Ekaros wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure that 100% of companies have not sold unsubscribed users information? As if there is even single counter-example you should just automatically mark it spam and then email providers should blacklist the domain.

You're absolutely incorrect about this. What you're saying may have been true a long time ago but it's 100% wrong now. In 2023/2024 you should click unsubscribe links. No matter how spammy a sender is, an unsubscribe click is a big signal that they don't want to contact that email account again. It takes time and money to warm up a domain, prepare it for outbound email, and keep it from being blacklisted when you're…

I don’t know how often I have clicked the unsubscribe link only to find I am not unsubscribed.

Plus the link is always at the bottom in a tiny footer.

The mark as spam button has no such issue and hurts the sender to boot.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#62

Post by blitzar »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #33
mulmen wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if the unsubscribe link works I still report spam as spam. If it is unsolicited then it is spam, plain and simple.

I'm very surprised to see you are being downvoted, I was convinced everybody is doing that. Spam is spam, period. Asking me go click on a link that leads somewhere is just a waste of my time - and there are still a few culprits out there who instead of unsubscribing me straight away demand that I log in to "manage my notification preferences"!

Furthermore I consider it a public service, if enough good people mark it as spam then the algorithm can block it for other users too.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#63

Post by _cenw »

most of the phishing emails bypassing my spam filters (on Fastmail) recently have been from prod.outlook.com

it's almost impossible to figure out where to report spam; most of their support articles are about how you report spam in Outlook instead. For reference, those reporting emails are:

phish@office365.microsoft.com

junk@office365.microsoft.com

but you get zero feedback, and I keep getting repeat phishing too

they care so little about cleaning up their own act, i'm considering just rejecting their stuff with a bounce message. i checked, and there's very little important traffic from prod.outlook.com arriving in my inbox.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#65

Post by danpalmer »

petemir wrote: post #10
snitch182 wrote: post #3

My private email server gets completly blocked on regular bases. They are blocking the whole ip-range of my provider. You get no response from them whatsoever. You have to fill out a form und wait a couple of days. You can however sign up for a 200$ whitelist... from a different company owned by guess who.

I worked for a company that sent travel deals newsletters everyday. Deliverability to (then) Hotmail was abysmal. We then got the recommendation of a company (cannot remember their name) that could analyse our IPs and give recommendations. Naturally, the recommendations were the ones that you could find everywhere so they were not useful, but the company did have access to MSFT's score of our IPs, so we could know wh…

Was it "Return Path"? If so, yes, they are just a racket. They ostensibly provide consulting services on this stuff, but in reality they have a (exclusive?) deal with Microsoft to change scores and allowlist, so you just pay them and they get your email through. Pricing is based on volume of email, I think we were paying $10k/yr for our emails to get to Microsoft hosted addresses.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#66

Post by gpderetta »

arp242 wrote: post #47
gpderetta wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do not need to be 100% sure. 99% of the time you explicitly unsubscribed from all categories, but the sender just added a new one and helpfully opted you in. So, yes, "fuck you".

And that other 1%[1] is just collateral damage? "Sucks to be you!" Please note they were suggesting that a single email should "blacklist the domain". You are pretty much suggesting the very thing Microsoft is doing here. This is not a serious suggestion in any shape or form. [1]: A number I have serious doubts about by the way, but we'll use it for now.

There is a very simple solution to the collateral damage: don't send anything that can be construed as spam.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#67

Post by 2Gkashmiri »

dathinab wrote: post #9

This is just that last of many cases of MS Outlook acting in an intentional power abusive market distorting way. I do not know about tutanota and if they are a bad actor in the email space. But I remember them having done funny things like banning the complete German Hetzner IP range because Hetzner didn't want to give them customers information without an curt order (which I guess Hetzner isn't allowed to do either…

i installed MIAB like 3 years ago. had this exact same problem with outlook at the time. did the same and never have had any more problems.

last year i helped someone install miab and somehow neither gmail nor outlook nor any "major" provider logged them as spam from the get go. i was truly impressed and surprised.

i have heard war stories about people self hosting email and having problems. sure 3-5-10 years ago that might have been the case but not now for the most part.

please give your self hosted email a try again. it will take you less time to set everything up than cooking dinner. try using miab or similar email software.

go cheap, like racknerd or something and save money from vultr/DO.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#68

Post by PedroBatista »

justinclift wrote: post #49
jacquesm wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The worst ones are the ones that add a whole paragraph to their spam to explain why it isn't spam and they have a right to send you their junk.

Yeah, those are lousy. Even worse though are places like Atlassian, which add a footer to some of their emails like "this email can't be unsubscribed from". Even though it's directly illegal for them to have emails that can't be unsubscribed from. It's their own special "Fuck You!" message to their email recipients.

Their lawyers will argue that’s a transactional email part of the functionality of the app, so they can play fast and loose with legal requirements

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#69

Post by zahllos »

hannofcart wrote: post #39

Recently, I managed to get my personal mail server working and delivering to Outlook. Of all the major mail providers, I found getting my mails to Outlook the hardest. Gmail played nice once I setup DKIM, DMARC, SPF, MTA-STS, rDNS and a couple more things that I forgot setup exactly the way they like it. Outlook was harder though. I had to send a series of mails spread over multiple days to people who had Outlook acc…

Outlook are a pain. If you don't regularly send email to outlook.com they forget your IP and start responding with 550s.

I have a daily message sent out from my server to a test account at outlook.com for two reasons: to try to work around this behaviour and to know immediately when there is a delivery issue.

Re: Microsoft Outlook Blocking All Email from Tutanota.com Domain as Spam

#70

Post by ZWoz »

PedroBatista wrote: post #64

To be fair, Hotmail / Outlook is known to be the worst of the worst when it comes to accepting emails. Even a spotlessly configured MTA will not guarantee you anything.

Putting on my "postmaster at shared hosting company" hat: Used to be. Gmail is done lot of work to be worse than Outlook. At least MS idiosyncraties are somewhat known and stable. I would say that most customer complaints are related to gmail.
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