Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine • Hacker News Board

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#61

Post by skrebbel » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 6:08 AM UTC

johansch wrote: post #8

I have been incredibly impressed with their demos over the years. Their wikipedia entry lists 28 (!) members. Did these guys work with any well known software/game companies/products?

Having 28 members isn't really considered a big accomplishment in the demoscene :-)

I can get together a group with 28 members in a single demoparty. We'll all be drunk idiots who forgot we signed up the day after, but we'd be 28 members.

Many of the Farbrausch guys work or have worked in the game industry. In fact, for a long time .theprodukkt (FR's somewhat more elitist and commercially feasible spinout) was planned to become a game company, but it never really did.

The same holds for most other good demomakers currently active. The entire Finnish demoscene makes mobile games, the Norwegians all work at ARM to make mobile graphics chips, and p01 works at Opera winning js1k competitions.

Meanwhile, the only somewhat active Spanish demoscener left codes Three.js at Google.

The Dutch are all unemployed.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#62

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 6:40 AM UTC

newobj wrote: post #46

pjmlp wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a very distance past, Watcom C++ used to be the best optimizing compiler for MS-DOS. It was also the first to support extended memory in MS-DOS.

I'm not arguing the existence of Watcom C++ 9.5/386 :) But let's be clear the first version of Watcom C++ was released in 1993. To suggest the demoscene started there is ludicrous.

There I agree with you.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#63

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 6:43 AM UTC

skrebbel wrote: post #59

buster wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess, you'll have to learn so much more then just C++, most likely assembler too, and a lot (lot lot lot) of tricks. Everytime i see those multi-minute long demos, with music and animations and see those in 64k (or even 4k intros!!) i'm baffled.

In fact, you don't have to learn C++ either. You can use any native compiled language without problems (say, Pascal). You can also use any other language as long as its runtime is small enough. Most important though, much more so than whether you know C++, is knowing graphics programming. In fact, I've been calling myself a democoder for 10 years now, and I still suck at graphics programming, which is why my demos su…

Actually in the PC Demoscene, many demos were done in Turbo Pascal with lots of inline assembly as well.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#64

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 6:48 AM UTC

pkrefta wrote: post #21

fredoliveira wrote: post #4

Most people who were a part of the scene in 2000 remember The Product (1). I remember it winning The Party and being struck by how impressive their work was. If you're on windows, I guess you can download the demo itself (2). At 64kb, it should be a pretty quick download ;-) Their impressiveness has only gone up since 2000, as you can see by watching Debris (3), which at 177kb beats the living crap out of most things…

Every time I see the this demo YT I want to teach myself C++ (despite I hate compiled languages) - this is great inspiration for me. Nowa days this graphics is not really that impressive but back in 2000 that was jaw-breaking OMG

There are many other compiled languages besides C++.

Here is a small list of languages with known native compiler implementations, that you could eventually use:

- Pascal (Actually all implementation have some extended form) - Modula-2 - Modula-3 - Oberon - Component Pascal - Ada - C - Objective-C - C++ - Ocaml - Haskell - D - Go - Fortran - Lisp - Scheme

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#65

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 6:50 AM UTC

vigo wrote: post #52

newobj wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really, the demo scene, which started out in the 80's, was using Watcom C++? Watch the behind scenes video of Second Reality (1993). They're coding Pascal and (duh) assembly. The demoscene was really born out of cracks/intros/loaders which means its origins are C64/Apple/Atari etc and assembly language.

yeps. almost correct. scene started with c64. pc scene / first demo came out from future crew : second reality. also in 1996, smash designs created second reality 100% same fx via C64 (:

1996?!

I don't understand your comment. There were lots of PC demos in the late 80's.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#66

Post by skrebbel » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 8:27 AM UTC

pjmlp wrote: post #63

skrebbel wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact, you don't have to learn C++ either. You can use any native compiled language without problems (say, Pascal). You can also use any other language as long as its runtime is small enough. Most important though, much more so than whether you know C++, is knowing graphics programming. In fact, I've been calling myself a democoder for 10 years now, and I still suck at graphics programming, which is why my demos su…

Actually in the PC Demoscene, many demos were done in Turbo Pascal with lots of inline assembly as well.

We were talking about now, not 20 years ago.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#67

Post by gaius » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 8:33 AM UTC

xaro wrote: post #56

DanBC wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A good place to start looking around is here: ( http://www.pouet.net/index.php ) Remember that a youtube capture of a demo will be bigger, and not as good quality, as the actual demo.

But the processing power needed to run it will be less.

Depends if you're using Flash to play the video :-p

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#68

Post by pjmlp » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 8:43 AM UTC

skrebbel wrote: post #66

pjmlp wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually in the PC Demoscene, many demos were done in Turbo Pascal with lots of inline assembly as well.

We were talking about now, not 20 years ago.

Now there is no longer a proper Demoscene.

In the old days a 64KB demo was really that. Now it is 64KB + several MB OS.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#69

Post by bashzor » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 9:34 AM UTC

> To whom it may concern,

> Yes, this source code is a total mess. Good luck getting it to compile - I had to take out lots of things to make a source release possible.

Well that sounds promising for a release. Good for seeing the idea behind the code though and then write your own tools I guess.

Re: Farbrausch (demoscene group) releases their tools and engine

#70

Post by jonbro » Mon, Apr 16, 2012, 1:21 PM UTC

_delirium wrote: post #29

aw3c2 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That origin was really really early and not too relevant here.

There wasn't ever really a clean break afaik, and the association (some groups more than others) continued through at least the 1990s. Fairlight were active in both scenes for over a decade, for example, though from what I can tell the group did slowly internally divide in terms of who was focusing on warez v. demos. More to the point, though, I think the association with reverse-engineering culture had a significant…

in fact, razor 1911 is still releasing both demos and warez. I don't know that they have any in the running for the scene awards, but they are getting ranked.