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Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

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Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#61

Post by riordan »

Sunday service has always been particularly important to the New York City public libraries. Andrew Carnegie’s original deal always was, he would find the construction of the branches the libraries would run the branches, and the city would fund the branches with seven-day service. For a while. the Carnegie branches open seven days a week, even as they had to follow through on cutbacks at the non-Carnegie branches.

But that ship sailed long ago. Very few were still able to offer Sunday service before this:

- NYPL (Manhattan/Bronx/Staten Island): 8/92 sites

- Brooklyn Public Library: 8/66 sites

- Queens Public Library: 2/66

(Yes, there are three separate public library systems for New York City. They pre-date the consolidation of the city and no matter how hard folks have tried every study on consolidating the three systems into a single organization, winds up costing significantly more than the current status quo.)

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#62

Post by anotherhue »

lapphi wrote: post #49
TimedToasts wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a decade as a public library board member. I saw every possible combination of anti-social behavior from the homeless that would encamp there. Many times I had to 'assist' asking someone to leave. The librarians _could_ have called the cops and had the violators permanently barred from re-entering but they would rarely do that. It is 100% scaring away families and elderly.

It’s interesting how we (as a culture) tolerate people who have broken the social contract. As Americans we’ve really let the bottom fall out. They’re so far away from society they do not care anymore about norms. And we do not care to do anything except let them exist in our spaces to the detriment of the public.

The costs they create far outweigh whatever a programme to help them would cost.

We're literally giving up on social activities and safety and trust because we're not willing to meaningfully address the down and outs.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#63

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

freeopinion wrote: post #60
NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly; that would be a Federal problem, not something that the City can do anything about. Secondly; even if they were illegal immigrants (which is undetermined at this point; most of them claim asylum and have had no determination made for their case) they would still have had the right to shelter under City law.

So you're saying that illegal immigration isn't really the problem?

I'm saying that the arrival of a large number of people, who are legally unable to work, and who have no support system from families, and whom the City is legally obliged to house is a problem.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#64

Post by 1letterunixname »

TimedToasts wrote: post #41
shortrounddev2 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally I hate the fact that libraries have become de facto homeless shelters. It gives them a constant background noise of danger and a lot of these people just sit around watching softcore porn on youtube. I think you'd see more library attendance if the places felt safer to leave kids at alone

I spent a decade as a public library board member. I saw every possible combination of anti-social behavior from the homeless that would encamp there. Many times I had to 'assist' asking someone to leave. The librarians _could_ have called the cops and had the violators permanently barred from re-entering but they would rarely do that. It is 100% scaring away families and elderly.

It's easy to paint with a broad brush "'the homeless' = bad". That is as casually discriminatory as being antisemitic and is offensive. Perhaps some empathy and nuance would help rather than condemning a group of people for the actions of individuals.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#65

Post by CrazyPyroLinux »

freeopinion wrote: post #60
NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly; that would be a Federal problem, not something that the City can do anything about. Secondly; even if they were illegal immigrants (which is undetermined at this point; most of them claim asylum and have had no determination made for their case) they would still have had the right to shelter under City law.

So you're saying that illegal immigration isn't really the problem?

And "inflation is transitory!" And "the chocolate ration has been increased to 20 grams!"

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#66

Post by CraigRo »

cakeface wrote: post #40
David_Axelrod wrote: post #3

Of course no one is happy about cuts to vital services like the library. But people are also unhappy with a 3% minimum city income tax and a $5 billion budget shortfall. Stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Tax the billionaires. Tax the vacant real estate holdings at the high end. Tax short term rentals.

We lost net 10 of them costing hundreds of millions of dollars already. Short term rentals were basically banned outright. Not very many vacant real estate holdings, and how are you going to prove that they were sufficiently vacant -- going to roust them all at night?

City needs to actually get its act together to become more efficient.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#67

Post by DANmode »

lapphi wrote: post #49
TimedToasts wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a decade as a public library board member. I saw every possible combination of anti-social behavior from the homeless that would encamp there. Many times I had to 'assist' asking someone to leave. The librarians _could_ have called the cops and had the violators permanently barred from re-entering but they would rarely do that. It is 100% scaring away families and elderly.

It’s interesting how we (as a culture) tolerate people who have broken the social contract. As Americans we’ve really let the bottom fall out. They’re so far away from society they do not care anymore about norms. And we do not care to do anything except let them exist in our spaces to the detriment of the public.

It's a "problem" of a nonhomogeneous populous: the wide range in definition of what maintains the social contract.

For some, if they in particular aren't disturbed from their AirPods, murder or other crime is a-ok.

For others, if you wear the wrong ratty clothes into the library, you're breaking the social contract.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#68

Post by DANmode »

cakeface wrote: post #40
David_Axelrod wrote: post #3

Of course no one is happy about cuts to vital services like the library. But people are also unhappy with a 3% minimum city income tax and a $5 billion budget shortfall. Stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Tax the billionaires. Tax the vacant real estate holdings at the high end. Tax short term rentals.

> Tax short term rentals.

Careful.

Don't fuck over the transient or temporarily (permanently!) displaced with these broad strokes.

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#69

Post by locopati »

jstarfish wrote: post #6
SoftTalker wrote: post #2

Sunday seems like a poor choice. Sunday was always a prime homework day for me when I was in school. Typically not a lot else going on, so there was time for quiet, focused work. Why not close on Tuesday or Wednesday? Unless it's also about staffing difficulty on weekends.

> Why not close on Tuesday or Wednesday? Library near my parents' house used to be closed or would close early on select weekdays. It really, really sucked for getting schoolwork/research projects done. We expect businesses to be open during the workweek. We do not always expect them to be open on weekends. I don't understand why they don't open late 7 days a week. Who goes to the library before noon? The kids are al…

in NYC, libraries are someplace folks without homes can hang out, use computers, be out of the weather

people work remotely from libraries (free wifi in a quiet environment and you don't have to buy coffee)

libraries offer services as well, especially for immigrant populations

Re: Sunday service suspended at all NYPL locations

#70

Post by antiframe »

jstarfish wrote: post #25
nvy wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Who goes to the library before noon? Parents with young kids/toddlers. Story Time at my local public library (not NY) is very well-attended.

Well, shit. Guess not all the kids are at school then.

That's right. School generally starts at age 5 or 6 and kids exist before that age.
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