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Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

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Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#61

Post by hightrix »

mortenjorck wrote: post #56
Pulcinella wrote: post #3

This really does seem like Unity is destroying their business for pennies. Mobile game display ads seem like a very, very low value business to be in and I would imagine rates are going down all the time. Unity may manage to wipe out AppLovin by burning down the rest of their business, but winning king-of-the-hill on top a pile of ashes does not seem to be a high value position. Edit: It's as if Unreal wants to be ki…

It's kind of amazing just how big a Rubicon they crossed. Like, they're going to walk the changes back at this point, I don't think that's even in question anymore – but it won't matter. They have broadcast loud and clear that they can and will alter the deal.

This is the biggest issue. Unity have clearly signaled that the previous and current user agreements to use their software are useless as they may be retroactively changed at any time.

What company would put their bottom line at risk dealing with these terms?

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#62

Post by CDSlice »

hcks wrote: post #57

[flagged]

This isn’t even close to accurate. For one thing, developers already pay to license the Unity engine, it’s only free if you agree to keep the unity logo loading screen and make under a certain amount of money.

Two, unlike the Reddit API changes which just annoyed mods at worst (yes there were problems for people with disabilities but that is such a small percentage it was basically a rounding error for them) this is an existential threat to F2P mobile games which are Unity’s largest market by far. When you aren’t directly selling the game and the only way to make money is to get as many downloads as possible in the hope that a certain small percentage buy IAPs these few cent fees per install could very easily wipe out their entire revenue.

Three, unlike Reddit which had no viable alternatives for the millions of end users to migrate to, Unity has far fewer customers and an extremely viable replacement in the form of Unreal and potentially Godot.

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#63

Post by WillPostForFood »

vore wrote: post #60
hcks wrote: post #57

[flagged]

A per-installation fee model is bonkers: of course Unity is allowed to charge for their product, but if your margins are already pretty thin, it's pretty hard to budget for a per-installation fee – not even per sale!

How many apps are successful enough to meet the revenue thresholds (over $1mil), but are sub $1 ARPU, and aren't ad revenue driven? I'm sure there are some, but that's going to be a small number, and there likely can be some carve out for them.

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#64

Post by Someone »

asabla wrote: post #44
Renaud wrote: post #36

Wondering if Microsoft shouldn't have bought Unity, It could have made sense, because of its focus on developer, because of its interests in gaming and because it's a huge showcase for C# and .Net as many of the features of unity could have been folded into regular .Net or there could have been an opportunity to have a '.GameNet' version, maybe.

I guess this could also be a play to make Microsoft interested in buying them out when money crisis hit. But I don't know, it could just be an ordinary bad bussiness decision

> I guess this could also be a play to make Microsoft interested in buying them out when money crisis hit.

That would be a stupid idea. Companies that are in financial trouble tend to be cheaper to buy, typically a lot cheaper if there’s only one serious buyer candidate.

If they think “when we’re almost broke, we can sell out to Microsoft for X million”, certainly they can get at least the same amount now that they aren’t?

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#65

Post by WillPostForFood »

TillE wrote: post #21
Pulcinella wrote: post #3

This really does seem like Unity is destroying their business for pennies. Mobile game display ads seem like a very, very low value business to be in and I would imagine rates are going down all the time. Unity may manage to wipe out AppLovin by burning down the rest of their business, but winning king-of-the-hill on top a pile of ashes does not seem to be a high value position. Edit: It's as if Unreal wants to be ki…

There's just no way this change is actually gonna happen. Many prominent indie developers have already announced they'll be switching away from Unity for future projects, and you have to think that larger studios are drawing the same conclusions. The ship is sinking. Unity will retract this. Switch to revenue share or whatever. They'll eat a huge loss of trust because of this idiocy, but they'll remain a relevant gam…

Revenue share is going to be worse for most indie developers - the .20 install fee is only bad for extremely high volume, low ARPU games. Basically mobile F2P. They deserve a different payment option, but switching everyone to revenue share is would be much worse for a typical Steam, $5+ indie game.

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#66

Post by sitzkrieg »

cratermoon wrote: post #47
belval wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mobile game display ads seem like a very, very low value business to be in Might be much less prestigious than selling games that aren't predatory, but Unity does in fact make a lot more money from selling ads in mobile games than licensing and by a very wide margin. The sad truth is that for every "real gamer", there are 10+ regular mom and pop playing candy crush and buying boosts every other day. > Create Soluti…

So Unity is a digital ad company that gives away a game engine, or sells it at a loss, as a way to sell ads targeted based on what they know about the people playing the game. Ad revenue is in decline across the whole industry, so now Unity is looking to get a bigger slice of the pie by displacing AppLovin as the data harvester/ad provider Aside: I wonder how much user data Unity-based games harvest from mobile devic…

they really always have been when you think about it. shame about the engine being a causality of war

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#67

Post by sitzkrieg »

Renaud wrote: post #36

Wondering if Microsoft shouldn't have bought Unity, It could have made sense, because of its focus on developer, because of its interests in gaming and because it's a huge showcase for C# and .Net as many of the features of unity could have been folded into regular .Net or there could have been an opportunity to have a '.GameNet' version, maybe.

on the flip side they kinda left XNA out to dry despite basically being the unity before unity in some ways for indie devs

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#68

Post by [deleted] »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #65
TillE wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's just no way this change is actually gonna happen. Many prominent indie developers have already announced they'll be switching away from Unity for future projects, and you have to think that larger studios are drawing the same conclusions. The ship is sinking. Unity will retract this. Switch to revenue share or whatever. They'll eat a huge loss of trust because of this idiocy, but they'll remain a relevant gam…

Revenue share is going to be worse for most indie developers - the .20 install fee is only bad for extremely high volume, low ARPU games. Basically mobile F2P. They deserve a different payment option, but switching everyone to revenue share is would be much worse for a typical Steam, $5+ indie game.

[deleted]

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#69

Post by hightrix »

hcks wrote: post #57

[flagged]

> The outrage is on par with the Reddit API drama (if anybody remember?)

You are spot on with this comment. Both Reddit's changes and Unity's changes will have/have had massive effect on the userbase.

Reddit's activity in many of the largest subreddits is down 50-90% from before July 1 when the changes went into effect. I imagine Unity will see similar numbers.

Re: Unity is offering a runtime fee waiver if you switch to LevelPlay

#70

Post by bbatsell »

pjc50 wrote: post #28
Pulcinella wrote: post #3

This really does seem like Unity is destroying their business for pennies. Mobile game display ads seem like a very, very low value business to be in and I would imagine rates are going down all the time. Unity may manage to wipe out AppLovin by burning down the rest of their business, but winning king-of-the-hill on top a pile of ashes does not seem to be a high value position. Edit: It's as if Unreal wants to be ki…

Unity want a cut of Genshin Impact and see everyone else as a rounding error.

Except that Genshin will not be subject to it. Genshin Impact is made by Mihoyo, a Chinese company. In order to sell Unity licenses to Chinese customers, Unity Technologies created a joint venture called Unity China, and, as is standard Chinese government policy, it must be majority-owned and controlled by Chinese entities. The majority owner of Unity China? Mihoyo.

(On top of that, it makes no sense — Genshin would be a poster child for revshare: a single entity that has made billions off microtransactions and that can be easily audited in one go.)

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