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Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

theguardian.com

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Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#61

Post by mcmoor »

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #50
0xfae wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fascinating. There are rules of the social game that people usually follow, but can be subverted in a move that cashes in reputation or "social capital" for a short term gain. If you do it too often, you lose favor and people will stop offering you things repeatedly, and you are expected to pick up on the social cues. I can see how that creates more social wiggle room than a strict set of rules that everyone is expec…

Reputation (or "Gift") economies are fascinating things, and a neat look into pre-(and maybe post-?)money society. In some ways, the analogy to currency holds: If you do a favor for me, I'm more likely to do a favor for you, there's a baked in "inflation" in that reputation decays over time. But in a lot of important ways, it differs: Me doing a favor for someone actually can make me more likely to do a future favor…

Yeah the main reason why our systems are getting increasingly depersonalized is because we have to deal with more and more complete strangers than before. Marvel of modern interactions is that we can trust (somewhat) this current trading partner despite never meeting this person and will never again. At the cost of distancing ourselves from people close to us.

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#62

Post by aeonik »

mgaunard wrote: post #27
jagged-chisel wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similar here. People still get annoyed when I ask. Dude, I’m just trying to save time. You can say “I don’t know” and I’ll go read. You don’t have to talk in circles, you don’t have the make something up (that will often be wrong), just admit the truth.

You should do your own research before disrupting others. It's basic politeness.

Research takes too long if you have access to sources directly. Documentation is rigid, and assumes the reader has some level of familiarity and state.

Growing up on the Internet has led, for me, to have a very eclectic and fragmented knowledge base.

Speaking with someone affords me to skip all the BS and more precisely target the information I'm after, it also gives the other person the opportunity to spot and fix XY problems, or to refer me to somewhere that will be more fruitful.

Also, I don't know where the threshold for "polite" is. I can research something for a decade, and people will still be frustrated with me.

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#63

Post by LoganDark »

lijok wrote: post #55
chankstein38 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. I have had it get me in trouble before because I was described as "developing like a gopher" where I disappear into a hole for _x_ time and then pop out with a bunch of questions or the entire ask completed without any input and both of those things tended to be negative as well. I'm not sure how to handle it sometimes. It seems like asking too many questions can get me judged and potentially make people see me…

I’ve taken on the attitude of “everyone is smart, therefore if I or someone else struggles to understand something, that something is badly designed” Makes it easier to ask questions, and when someone is asking you silly questions, it allows you to direct your frustration towards the subject itself rather than the person. Doesn’t work so well with things that weren’t designed however, such as physics, or Rust

> Doesn’t work so well with things that weren’t designed however, such as physics, or Rust

Rust wasn't designed...?

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#64

Post by LoganDark »

JuanPosadas wrote: post #60
chankstein38 wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right? I hate when I ask someone something and their response is to go way overboard in answering. "Do you have time for a 30min video call to talk about it?" kinds of things. I mean, obviously it's appreciated but if you don't know (just say so) or if it's that massive just point me at an article or a nice reference pull request or something.

The "I can't communicate anything without a full video chat" types are the worst for sure.

The "video" types are the worst. Talk to me over text only. Phone calls are also unacceptable.

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#65

Post by LoganDark »

awkward wrote: post #48
ics wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many variables indeed but it's an interesting thought to consider. In my experience friends and relatives with autism are hard askers and those with diagnosed ADHD/OCD/related are all guessers without exception.

Many people with ADHD suffer from rejection sensitive dysphoria - often an unexpected "no" will wreck their day. Limiting dependence on others and over-preparing for a big ask is a way to protect their own mental well being.

> often an unexpected "no" will wreck their day

I have ADHD and RSD and this is me when asking anything: https://twitter.com/sensorystories_/status/16956149519377409...

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#66

Post by LoganDark »

corobo wrote: post #11

I wonder if there's any correlation, causation, whatever, between the guesser segment of the population and socially disrupting mental disorders. Autism, ADHD, etc. Giving it a quick think with the people I know (given that I don't know the mental health status of people without diagnoses) it's an almost perfect split. A secondary wonder comes in due to the theory of mind deficit that can come with those disorders -…

Small nit, but being autistic itself isn't a mental disorder, it's simply a neurotype. It can result in ASD, but doesn't necessarily.

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#67

Post by crazygringo »

a1o wrote: post #56
crazygringo wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I think you're missing the point the neither is correct/better, and it's certainly not about which one is more empathetic or thoughtful. "Guesser" doesn't seem deprecating at all. You might as well say "asker" sounds demanding and impertinent, but it's not meant to be either. And you could just as easily say that askers are the ones who empathize and think about others because they want to avoid misunderstandings…

You are missing the point, the "Asker" can be a demanding idiot, but if you frame as "just asking" it tries to absorb any blame as it puts the burden of figuring out things at whoever has to answer. I think this dynamic analysis is written from an "Asker" perspective and this reflects in the choice of words.

No I'm sorry but you are continuing to miss the point.

Sure, the asker can be a "demanding idiot". But a guesser can also expect everyone to be able to read their mind -- which is being just as much of a "demanding idiot".

You seem to actually be insisting that one cultural pattern is better than the other, when there's simply no objective basis for that assertion whatsoever.

You're concluding that the article/analysis is written from one bias, but I think it's actually revealing your own personal bias here. The article seems entirely objective and neutral to both viewpoints, whereas your reactions are clearly not.

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#68

Post by corobo »

LoganDark wrote: post #66
corobo wrote: post #11

I wonder if there's any correlation, causation, whatever, between the guesser segment of the population and socially disrupting mental disorders. Autism, ADHD, etc. Giving it a quick think with the people I know (given that I don't know the mental health status of people without diagnoses) it's an almost perfect split. A secondary wonder comes in due to the theory of mind deficit that can come with those disorders -…

Small nit, but being autistic itself isn't a mental disorder, it's simply a neurotype. It can result in ASD, but doesn't necessarily.

That's a fair comment, if I'm honest I was going by the second D in ADHD (personal bias!) and then decided to lump everyone else in - Apologies!

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#69

Post by corobo »

corobo wrote: post #68
LoganDark wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small nit, but being autistic itself isn't a mental disorder, it's simply a neurotype. It can result in ASD, but doesn't necessarily.

That's a fair comment, if I'm honest I was going by the second D in ADHD (personal bias!) and then decided to lump everyone else in - Apologies!

(and to clarify that I meant the people I thought of as examples, not the list of mental conditions)

Re: Are you an Asker or a Guesser? (2010)

#70

Post by LoganDark »

corobo wrote: post #68
LoganDark wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small nit, but being autistic itself isn't a mental disorder, it's simply a neurotype. It can result in ASD, but doesn't necessarily.

That's a fair comment, if I'm honest I was going by the second D in ADHD (personal bias!) and then decided to lump everyone else in - Apologies!

Honestly, I've never met anyone who identifies as a non-disordered autistic, probably because it's usually only identified through the disordered symptoms.
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