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How to find time to learn after work (2017)

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Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#61

Post by piva00 »

avocabros wrote: post #19
FirmwareBurner wrote: post #3

>"For example, I’m commuting every day 2×45 minutes to my workplace and back home. I need 5 minutes to get to the train station with my bike, 10 minutes to wait for the (connecting) trains, 25 minutes actually on the trains, 5 minutes to get from the train to my working place" There's a big one right there. Time lost due to commute times are actually much longer than the door-to-door time. It's not just the 90 min th…

WFH is one solution, but it's not free in terms of collaboration costs. There's a reason no one thinks college is better remote, for example. Sure, it's fine for some jobs but it's not super obvious that it's a net positive for output. People can also live closer to work, or use other methods (biking, running, etc.) to combine exercise + commute. Many studies have indicate that people overestimate the happiness of a…

> People can also live closer to work

That's getting unrealistic since it's becoming unaffordable even for well-paid salaried jobs, it's a non-solution given the current housing situation in most of the major cities where jobs actually are.

> WFH is one solution, but it's not free in terms of collaboration costs.

Why should the employee bear the costs of it though? If collaboration is better in-person what can employers do to enable that? I shouldn't be paying with my lifetime for the eventual benefit the corporation gets with in-person work, I surely wasn't happier nor more productive when I had to work in crappy open-plan offices with all its distractions: people passing by, doors being open/closed, chatter from other groups, interruptions from people wanting to ask questions right-the-fucking-now, having to work 100% of the time with headphones to be able to focus, etc. On top of that I had to pay the commute both in cash and time, the only way I'm going back to the office is if there's a significant increase in pay to compensate the inconvenience.

The increase in pay can come as a 4-day work week as well, then I wouldn't mind at all going back to the office even if my commute is 2h/day. A completely free day is much more valuable than the snippets of free time I get after a work day, days I don't have much energy left to do what I actually want in my life.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#62

Post by wink »

TheFragenTaken wrote: post #21

Ugh. Posts like this are well meaning, but destructive. Why would you learn after work? Why do you strive towards something? Why is it important to learn, and constantly evolve? Are you really just doing it, because everyone else are, and you feel like you _have_ to? It's poisonous, because you end up blaming yourself because you are not living up to constantly changing external demands. It's okay to say no to what c…

I didn't get that _at all_. If you are interested in stuff that is not related to your work (so learning on the job is out), what else would you do?

To me this sounded like the author likes to read and learn about things, but these just happen to also be tech. So they found a way to make time and describe how. I don't see any holier than thou "this is how you must do it", just a simple "this works for me". But YMMV.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#63

Post by consoomer »

Transpire7487 wrote: post #39

Get up at 6am. Get kids ready for school. Help my wife with any chores around the house for a bit. Start working. Lift on my lunch break in my home gym. Back to work. Kids come home. Feed them. Help with homework. Do something with them outside weather permitting. Put them to bed, read to/with them. Get lunches ready for tomorrow. Load the dishwasher. Load the laundry. My turn to walk the dog. Be mentally and physica…

Here's mine:

Wake up at 4AM. Stretch Achilles (gets stiff when I sleep), make a coffee and check emails/prep for the day in my notebook. From 4:20 to 5AM I run 5K and then shower. From about 5AM to 7AM I work on my own stuff/learn/whatever. At 7AM I wake up the wife and help get kids ready for school. I walk with the kids to school at 8AM. From 8:30 to 3PM I work on my stuff and have lunch somewhere in there. I walk to the kids' school and pick them up at 3PM. Work on my stuff until 5-6PM. Help out with dinner, kids, play, etc. Put kids to sleep around 9PM.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#64

Post by sanderjd »

BaseballPhysics wrote: post #57
dlisboa wrote: post #24

Companies should devote actual work time for studying, because relying on personal time is not just unethical, but inefficient. It's way cheaper to pay people to study in-house than paying for outside training or bootcamps. Not everyone can (or want) to study this way, but devoted focused time give you far more benefits than one hour a day randomly whenever you can squeeze it. You can read most books (even technical…

Totally agreed. This was my policy with my staff. I straight up told them they can and should take a couple hours a week (tried to start small to make it achievable) on personal development, whether that's reading books, taking courses, etc. I'd even try and brainstorm with them on ways to spend the time. Funny thing is, with one or two exceptions, few did it because they always felt something else was more urgent du…

I think this is sort of like unlimited vacation time policies: if you really want people to take advantage of it because you really believe in its value, you actually have to constantly nudge many, maybe most, people to do it.

In the case of training / education, a good solution may be to provide more structure. Get a group of people to sign up for an actual structured class (or run one yourself), and set the expectation that they actually go to the meetings and/or do the work for it. Just "figure out some time to read some books on your own" will work for some people, but lots of people thrive on more structure than that.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#65

Post by teddyh »

pluijzer wrote: post #55
Transpire7487 wrote: post #39

Get up at 6am. Get kids ready for school. Help my wife with any chores around the house for a bit. Start working. Lift on my lunch break in my home gym. Back to work. Kids come home. Feed them. Help with homework. Do something with them outside weather permitting. Put them to bed, read to/with them. Get lunches ready for tomorrow. Load the dishwasher. Load the laundry. My turn to walk the dog. Be mentally and physica…

"Help with homework", I have seen this in movies. Is this a cultural thing? I don't know any parents that help there children with homework.

Culturally normalized cheating. Also gives advantage to those with rich parents who can afford the time.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#66

Post by kris_lujanovic »

Finally a topic I mastered. As very very late started and IT outsider until recently:

Show up 15 - 30 minutes early to work and pick the most useful skill upgrade that will get you promoted or make your job easier / make you faster.

This is bare minimum to get constant promotions. Stay 15 min after work and do quick analysis what did you do and how to do it better.

During work always volunteer for documentation or training. Make sure you squeeze little research into both. And do proper detailed paperwork for both.

Harass your boss for training, labs, conferences at every moment esp when someone compliments either you learning something new or your performance / execution.

Study vacations. I have 25 days off and 5 of those are for intensive courses. somewhere interesting. This does not have to be directly related to job skills. You still have to be social and talk to people so language learning and cooking /dancing abroad is still beneficial.

Once you train yourself how to do this try not to think and stress about it. Learning needs to be intense but with playful fun approach and mood.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#68

Post by consoomer »

teddyh wrote: post #65
pluijzer wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Help with homework", I have seen this in movies. Is this a cultural thing? I don't know any parents that help there children with homework.

Culturally normalized cheating. Also gives advantage to those with rich parents who can afford the time.

It's cheating to help a 7 year old understand how to do basic math? Because the alternative is them staring at a paper and writing random numbers down.

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#69

Post by Balgair »

consoomer wrote: post #63
Transpire7487 wrote: post #39

Get up at 6am. Get kids ready for school. Help my wife with any chores around the house for a bit. Start working. Lift on my lunch break in my home gym. Back to work. Kids come home. Feed them. Help with homework. Do something with them outside weather permitting. Put them to bed, read to/with them. Get lunches ready for tomorrow. Load the dishwasher. Load the laundry. My turn to walk the dog. Be mentally and physica…

Here's mine: Wake up at 4AM. Stretch Achilles (gets stiff when I sleep), make a coffee and check emails/prep for the day in my notebook. From 4:20 to 5AM I run 5K and then shower. From about 5AM to 7AM I work on my own stuff/learn/whatever. At 7AM I wake up the wife and help get kids ready for school. I walk with the kids to school at 8AM. From 8:30 to 3PM I work on my stuff and have lunch somewhere in there. I walk…

You get less than 7 hours of sleep a day?

Re: How to find time to learn after work (2017)

#70

Post by consoomer »

Balgair wrote: post #69
consoomer wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's mine: Wake up at 4AM. Stretch Achilles (gets stiff when I sleep), make a coffee and check emails/prep for the day in my notebook. From 4:20 to 5AM I run 5K and then shower. From about 5AM to 7AM I work on my own stuff/learn/whatever. At 7AM I wake up the wife and help get kids ready for school. I walk with the kids to school at 8AM. From 8:30 to 3PM I work on my stuff and have lunch somewhere in there. I walk…

You get less than 7 hours of sleep a day?

Yeah--- seven days a week. I do the same routine on the weekend.
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