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Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

blog.mozilla.org

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Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#61

Post by Rebelgecko »

wmf wrote: post #50
Rebelgecko wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to get existential, why should Mozilla support users on any non-free platform? I imagine they're able to justify Windows because of the huge user base justified the additional engineering effort. The blog uses "we're the only browser still supporting Windows 7" as an excuse to stop supporting it, but to me that same sentence is also an opportunity and maybe even a moral argument to keep supporting older h…

Mozilla "works to ensure the internet remains a public resource that is open and accessible to us all", not to advocate free software.

Windows 7 users are a subset of "us all". If anything they should be focusing on FF users who don't have any remaining alternative for a modern browser. They're the ones whose internet access is most at risk.

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#62

Post by _nalply »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #54
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Running a 14 year old operating system in the world we live in today is dangerous and stupid. If you don't like newer Windows, that's fine, don't use Windows. But operating systems that old should be relegated to airgapped machines for historical purposes.

Last year I found an old xp machine that I wanted to show to a kid to learn to mess with. Took me hours to get Firefox because everything else refuses to work. That was because I remembered the Mozilla download site directly. Then, programs screaming end of support and security and vulnerability and what not. WHAT IS THE THREAT MODEL HERE? I come from a place which got high speed internet only 2 years ago. Until then…

> EVRRYONE USED TO DISABlE WINDOWS UPDATE, because data was precious and guess what happened, nothing.

Nothing obviously visible, you mean.

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#63

Post by XCSme »

Dalewyn wrote: post #41
ororroro wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3rd most installs. Windows 11 identifies as windows 10 for reasons.

That's because the kernel identifies as NT10.0. Internally it's the same as Windows 10. Similarly, Windows 2000 and XP identify as NT5.0 and 5.1 respectively, and Windows Vista/7/8/8.1 identify as NT6.0, 6.1, 6.2, and 6.3 respectively. Incidentally, this is also why drivers often are cross-compatible along certain Windows versions.

What does NT stand for?

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#64

Post by Dalewyn »

XCSme wrote: post #63
Dalewyn wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because the kernel identifies as NT10.0. Internally it's the same as Windows 10. Similarly, Windows 2000 and XP identify as NT5.0 and 5.1 respectively, and Windows Vista/7/8/8.1 identify as NT6.0, 6.1, 6.2, and 6.3 respectively. Incidentally, this is also why drivers often are cross-compatible along certain Windows versions.

What does NT stand for?

There are a number of theories and backstories[1], but most commonly it's understood that it once stood for New Technology.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT#Naming

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#65

Post by FreshStart »

eviks wrote: post #58
slome wrote: post #17

This allows Mozilla to trim away some of the cruft and have more time available to focus on actually improving Firefox for people living in this day and age. There will always be someone who feels left behind but to me this decision is a no-brainer.

There will also be a lot of people actually left behind, but of course there will always be people who don't care about it

Goto prepare it for modern users

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#66

Post by shadowgovt »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #54
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Running a 14 year old operating system in the world we live in today is dangerous and stupid. If you don't like newer Windows, that's fine, don't use Windows. But operating systems that old should be relegated to airgapped machines for historical purposes.

Last year I found an old xp machine that I wanted to show to a kid to learn to mess with. Took me hours to get Firefox because everything else refuses to work. That was because I remembered the Mozilla download site directly. Then, programs screaming end of support and security and vulnerability and what not. WHAT IS THE THREAT MODEL HERE? I come from a place which got high speed internet only 2 years ago. Until then…

> You actually believe if I use Firefox with ubo on windows 7 that suddenly malware would jump on my machine, turn it into a bot and destroy data?

https://www.cvedetails.com/cve/CVE-2011-5046/ is a remote-code-execution attack that works via setting the height of an IFRAME because the graphics device interface doesn't vet the size of the resulting buffers generated to support that IFRAME.

It won't just jump on your machine, but it is a threat you may be continuously vulnerable to for every website you choose to access with an insufficiently-patched Win7 install. And with Win7 now EOL, there are fewer eyes on it looking for vulnerabilities that will report those vulns.

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#67

Post by shadowgovt »

Dalewyn wrote: post #60
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot more ways to exploit a Windows OS than JavaScript if you load websites at all. We won't even get into "if you ever read an email or open a document". Have you ever seen things in a different font?

Sure, fonts local to my machine. Remote fonts can go to hell, and I've likewise got cookies and JavaShit all blocked as emails go because WTF does email need them for? Seriously, my threat model doesn't include anything that updates claim to guard against. I'm not a fucking enterprise server, nor does any government specifically want my shit. Try arguing for me to update my router before talking about the virtues of…

Does disabling JavaScript also disable loading iframes? IIRC it does not, but my memory's hazy on the topic.

This exploit allows arbitrary code execution by requesting too big a height for an iframe, which corrupts a GDI data structure.

https://www.cvedetails.com/cve/CVE-2011-5046/

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#68

Post by wmf »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #61
wmf wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mozilla "works to ensure the internet remains a public resource that is open and accessible to us all", not to advocate free software.

Windows 7 users are a subset of "us all". If anything they should be focusing on FF users who don't have any remaining alternative for a modern browser. They're the ones whose internet access is most at risk.

People who refused the free 7 -> 10 upgrade aren't an oppressed minority; they're the infosec equivalent of anti-vaxers. Why should Mozilla support you if you refuse to maintain your computer?

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#69

Post by hulitu »

nikanj wrote: post #25
whoopdedo wrote: post #19

Windows 7 is 12.9% of Firefox installs and the second most used OS. https://data.firefox.com/dashboard/hardware

Neither Edge nor Chrome support Windows 7, so it's not surprising a lot of Firefox users are on Windows 7 - because the other options are no longer available on Windows 7

Edge came after Win 10.

Re: Mozilla ending support for Windows 7

#70

Post by hulitu »

flangola7 wrote: post #56
whoopdedo wrote: post #19

Windows 7 is 12.9% of Firefox installs and the second most used OS. https://data.firefox.com/dashboard/hardware

This is terrifying. Windows 7 was EoL in early 2020. If you're in a time where you've heard about COVID-19 you shouldn't be using 7.

Why not ? Win 10 is a terrible OS.
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