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Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

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Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#61

Post by stuxnet79 »

calderknight wrote: post #60
akiselev wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A fascinating thought is that we might have been doing this since _before_ homo sapiens emerged as a species. We've got plenty of evidence that we had cultural propagation of knowledge among our early ancestors for over three millions of years via the Oldowan and Acheulean stone industries. Since hunter gatherers naturally passed along knowledge of the safety of edible plants, at what point did they figure out how to…

How long have Homo Sapiens been around? More or less than three million years?

Anatomically modern 'homo sapiens' have been around for much less than that - 120,000 years

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#62

Post by kevviiinn »

sudosysgen wrote: post #58
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People who drink too much do even more damage to their bodies and brains than any other drug It’s possible to do a lot of damage with heavy drinking, yes, but it’s not true at all to suggest alcohol is the most damaging drug. There are numerous synthetic drugs that can produce long lasting damage or even death even in experienced drug users who believe themselves to be consuming responsibly.

Alcohol is a drug that very often produces long lasting damage or even death in experienced users who believe to be drinking responsibly. In fact, it causes long lasting damage to a very significant portion of its users.

One unique aspect of alcohol when compared to other recreational drugs is the fact that its metabolite, acetaldehyde, damages DNA, it's a well known carcinogen. Ethanol itself also disrupts DNA methylation

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#63

Post by knodi123 »

frant-hartm wrote: post #21
reducesuffering wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine opioid pills were OTC. For a lot of people, they will initially be instant feel-good happy pills, even though people know there will be disastrous repercussions to taking them indefinitely. How many people go through bouts of severe depression? Won't some percentage of them, in moments of weakness, decide to try the opioid pills, feel good, and get sucked in? Shouldn't we as a society, try to curb humanity's…

No we shouldn't. There is a big difference between a parent safely bringing up a child and a state interfering with what an adult person does to themselves. Otherwise you open a can of greater good worms. If you have money, opioids are easily available via dealers throughout the world and there is no epidemic of addicts. Yes there are individual cases, but most of these would be destroying their lives in some other a…

> If you have money, opioids are easily available via dealers throughout the world and there is no epidemic of addicts.

Most people don't know a dealer, and don't have the confidence to try to find one without worrying about the risk of contacting a narc or a tattletale or in some other ways destroying their lives because of the legal system.

Hurdles matter. It's like common sense gun control- red flag laws, waiting periods, assault weapon bans, etc. None of those things make it impossible to have a mass shooting - but they make it a little harder, and that will stop a certain percentage of people.

Dangerous drugs like opioids should be available, cheaply, by prescription only, and "addiction" should be a sufficient reason for the prescription. This makes the safe and secure drug source the correct choice for vulnerable addicts, still lets us drive the black market and drug cartels out of business, it prevents crazy impulse purchases, and the requirement to renew your prescription periodically gives you a chance for a responsible adult to non-judgmentally offer you resources for achieving sobriety. It's a win-win-win, guaranteed to lower death tolls and crime rates, but unlikely to increase the number of addicts.

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#64

Post by akiselev »

calderknight wrote: post #60
akiselev wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A fascinating thought is that we might have been doing this since _before_ homo sapiens emerged as a species. We've got plenty of evidence that we had cultural propagation of knowledge among our early ancestors for over three millions of years via the Oldowan and Acheulean stone industries. Since hunter gatherers naturally passed along knowledge of the safety of edible plants, at what point did they figure out how to…

How long have Homo Sapiens been around? More or less than three million years?

The oldest homo sapien fossil is about 300,000 years old. 3 million years ago would still be in the latter half of the reign of the Australopithecus genus. Homo habilis hadn't even appeared yet to kick off our genus.

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#65

Post by kevviiinn »

xp84 wrote: post #38
frant-hartm wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No we shouldn't. There is a big difference between a parent safely bringing up a child and a state interfering with what an adult person does to themselves. Otherwise you open a can of greater good worms. If you have money, opioids are easily available via dealers throughout the world and there is no epidemic of addicts. Yes there are individual cases, but most of these would be destroying their lives in some other a…

This is an area where we must acknowledge that one's "values" frame of reference is inextricably linked to how you decide this question. Yes, we definitely are sacrificing some of everyone's bodily autonomy because we think it's less bad than the consequences of putting no limits on it. Caffeine, Alcohol, Cigarettes, Cannabis, Cocaine, Meth, Heroin, Fentanyl, biological weapons and on some parallel track: BB gun, .22…

Are you genuinely suggesting that cannabis is more harmful than alcohol

Not to mention, do people use biological weapons recreationally? That's news to me

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#66

Post by calderknight »

akiselev wrote: post #64
calderknight wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How long have Homo Sapiens been around? More or less than three million years?

The oldest homo sapien fossil is about 300,000 years old. 3 million years ago would still be in the latter half of the reign of the Australopithecus genus. Homo habilis hadn't even appeared yet to kick off our genus.

That makes sense. I was confused because I just read a paragraph that talked about archaic humans of 2 million years ago. But now I realise it was using the term in a more general sense - specific to Homo rather than Homo Sapien

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#67

Post by josephcsible »

frant-hartm wrote: post #21
reducesuffering wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine opioid pills were OTC. For a lot of people, they will initially be instant feel-good happy pills, even though people know there will be disastrous repercussions to taking them indefinitely. How many people go through bouts of severe depression? Won't some percentage of them, in moments of weakness, decide to try the opioid pills, feel good, and get sucked in? Shouldn't we as a society, try to curb humanity's…

No we shouldn't. There is a big difference between a parent safely bringing up a child and a state interfering with what an adult person does to themselves. Otherwise you open a can of greater good worms. If you have money, opioids are easily available via dealers throughout the world and there is no epidemic of addicts. Yes there are individual cases, but most of these would be destroying their lives in some other a…

> opioids are easily available via dealers throughout the world and there is no epidemic of addicts

There is absolutely an epidemic of opioid addicts.

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#68

Post by mlucient »

voldacar wrote: post #59
pash wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The role of the courts in deciding the constitutionality of legislation was very much in the zeitgeist of the American experiment. Federalist , No. 78: > It is not otherwise to be supposed, that the Constitution could intend to enable the representatives of the people to substitute their will to that of their constituents. It is far more rational to suppose, that the courts were designed to be an intermediate body be…

Where in the constitution is that power described or given?

Article III. "The judicial Power of the United States, shall be vested in one supreme Court..."

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#69

Post by sidewndr46 »

akiselev wrote: post #54
kortex wrote: post #48

> Thus, opium alkaloids were detected in Late Bronze Age containers > different hallucinogenic compounds, mainly nicotine, tryptamines and tropane alkaloids have been chemically documented in Prehispanic artefacts from the Americas, and psychoactive compounds of Cannabis in archaeological wooden braziers from China. > The alkaloids ephedrine, atropine and scopolamine were detected, and their concentrations estimated…

A fascinating thought is that we might have been doing this since _before_ homo sapiens emerged as a species. We've got plenty of evidence that we had cultural propagation of knowledge among our early ancestors for over three millions of years via the Oldowan and Acheulean stone industries. Since hunter gatherers naturally passed along knowledge of the safety of edible plants, at what point did they figure out how to…

Wasn't this proposition put forth by Terence McKenna?

Re: Direct evidence of the use of multiple drugs in Bronze Age from human hair test

#70

Post by pash »

voldacar wrote: post #59
pash wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The role of the courts in deciding the constitutionality of legislation was very much in the zeitgeist of the American experiment. Federalist , No. 78: > It is not otherwise to be supposed, that the Constitution could intend to enable the representatives of the people to substitute their will to that of their constituents. It is far more rational to suppose, that the courts were designed to be an intermediate body be…

Where in the constitution is that power described or given?

Article III, Sec. 2, clearly, which begins:

> The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution …

Let’s not continue this conversation. The view I’m presenting is long established and can be found better and much more extensively made in a great many sources which no one should have any trouble finding, should he wish. You, I infer, do not wish.

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