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A rant on web font licenses

manuelmoreale.com

61–70 of 169 posts

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#61
Yeah, it can be a pain to pay font creators, but I expect that this web designer would be annoyed if his clients complained about paying him.

Yes, some of the mechanisms can be fragile or troublesome, but I think that's the market's way of exploring possible options. The companies that came up with the idea of charging per the page view were probably responding to designers who didn't want to pay too much for small jobs. It's a trade off.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#62
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is ridiculous. HTML rendering is robust enough to work without CSS. A missing font should just be defaulted to serif or sans and that's it.

It wasn't missing, it was slow. Are you going to re kern and re layout the page when the font arrives? If you want to avoid that then you have to wait.

Yes, better a fallback than to completely block.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#63
The Akzidenz-Grotesk typeface which is referred to in this article was first released in 1898, meaning that any patent or copyright claims on the original designs will have well and truly expired by now. However, specific digitisations of typefaces are subject to copyright individually, which is what allows such companies to charge royalties for their use.

Whilst I couldn't find any truly free and open digitisations of Akzidenz-Grotesk, Berthold do seem to have a 'personal use only' licence which may be sufficient for a personal website.

A passable substitute for Akzidenz-Grotesk (and a very nice free typeface in its own right) is Liberation Sans, freely available under the SIL Open Font License 1.1.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#64
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is ridiculous. HTML rendering is robust enough to work without CSS. A missing font should just be defaulted to serif or sans and that's it.

It wasn't missing, it was slow. Are you going to re kern and re layout the page when the font arrives? If you want to avoid that then you have to wait.

This kind of thing is why I block all web fonts. I don't want to wait, and I don't want the page to reflow while I'm reading it. The best way to do that is to use the system fonts (which also happen to be nice, on a Mac).

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#65
post #12

In my opinion in most cases it's neither worth the price nor worth the effort to use paid fonts on a website. There's a huge amount of fonts for free on Google Fonts. Also, yoou are allowed to host them on your own server, so there's no privacy issue.

In Austria there was recently a case of a women sueing thousands of businesses for using google fonts on their website. The reasoning was that the fonts are hosted on google, so by visiting these sites they sent her IP to google without her knowing (what is meant is just the font download via the browser from google servers, nothing was actually "sent"). Apparently she visited these thousands of business websites one by one and the infringement on her privacy caused her so much emotional damage that she wanted to be compensated for it. The women herself remained anonymous but last I heard the lawyer that worked with her on this got his tires slashed and threatend with violence.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#66
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a lot better than most, that's for sure. But I still don't understand why they have all these arbitrary usage rules like the maximum of three websites. I look at fonts like tools. As a dev who also does design I should be able to buy it once and have it available as a tool at my disposal.

For any use case? You join a F500 company and now they can use it? What if you leave the company. It makes sense if you are freelancer and can use it with an arbitrary number of clients. But then does it transfer when those clients sites are bought/sold/merged/rebuilt ? The problem is that the use isn't restricted to you as a designer, but is distributed by your clients. That makes it different than a hammer, or an I…

I think yours are good points and I'd be happy to figure out ways to work around those but honestly, those sound more sensible problems to solve than what we have now where we have sites like MyFonts that sell you fonts with pre-paid page views that expire after a certain date. Like, what the hell...

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#67
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is ridiculous. HTML rendering is robust enough to work without CSS. A missing font should just be defaulted to serif or sans and that's it.

It wasn't missing, it was slow. Are you going to re kern and re layout the page when the font arrives? If you want to avoid that then you have to wait.

> Are you going to re kern and re layout the page when the font arrives?

It makes me angry that this is even a sentence. Call me an old fart but I really felt that the web lost the thread when this became a concern. Websites shouldn't be magazines. Typography and layouts are nice to have, but the first priority should be information and content.

But then the marketing people got involved and it had to become part of the "brand experience". Just give me a HTML table with your menu items, description, and prices. Or even better just the data in an XML file and I can read it without JavaScript and animations and awkward navigation patterns.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#68
post #35

I think it's often a mistake to insist on a third-party font if an environment-/OS-native font family does a good enough job already - it's just more data transferred, text often "jumping" around when the font data has finally been processed and is ready to render, and (often, in real-world use) data needlessly exfiltrated to some font-hosting CDN operator. The only third-party font I'd consider using (for reasons of…

Self-hosted fonts load extremely fast for the user if you are conservative with what you include. The fallback system font should be as similar as possible, so that text doesn't jump around.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#69
post #15
post #4

> Typefaces are, to the best of my knowledge, the only digital product that try to fuck you over with bullshit licenses Has Oracle disappeared? The article is kind of true though, especially when you need a font for a small part of your website like headers, the licence often make it not worth it if you're not a company. There's no middle ground between "here's your free font" and "pay me/us a lot of money".

This is the same line that made me scratch my head. I'm a non-network guy who has been stuck migrating our phone system from PRI to SIP, and every time I think I get it done, I have to buy another license from Cisco--that our resellers didn't tell us about at the beginning of the project. The latest issues is our voice gateways need a special security license to handle TLS. Outside that, cost per usage is one of the…

In my defense, I did say "to the best of my knowledge" :)

I'm just a designer/developer so I don't have deep knowledge of most of the tech world and I'm sure there are some crazy stories out there I am unaware of. But as I said, I'd be more than happy to hear them.

Re: A rant on web font licenses

#70
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically fonts are copyrightable but typefaces are not. Font names are also trademarkable. https://glarts.org/font-and-typeface-legal-tip-sheet/

If that holds up in court, why aren't there free/open source/cheaper versions of typefaces that look just like some font but are named differently?

There are: for quite a famous example see Monotype's Arial which is effectively free for Windows/Office users and is mostly indistinguishable from Helvetica by people who are not typography experts.

Most free clones are not as good in various ways, and good clones that are charged for probably get earn their creators a letter from a foundry's legal team that makes them decide that the cost (time and money) of defending their position (even though they should eventually win) is not worth it.

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