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The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

nytimes.com

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Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#61

Post by d4nt »

freehunter wrote: post #48
d4nt wrote: post #14

This is good news for Microsoft, and I really do hope they do well, but there's still a mountain to climb: tech reviewers are not the same as normal consumers and impressing them for the limited period of time it takes to write a review does not necessarily translate onto having a successful product. Here are a few challenges Microsoft still face: 1. Getting the mobile networks to take handsets running Windows Phone.…

The UX must be consistently slick This point is useless, the entire number 4 in your post. First of all, if you're using it as a point, you've never used a Windows Phone. It's as stable as an iPhone (certainly moreso than Android), I've had one since April and have never had a crash, lockup, or misplaced UI element. You seem to be bringing that from Windows Mobile, which is hands down the biggest thing holding Window…

I used a Windows Mobile for a couple of years (two different handsets). I found that while the main screens were reasonably well skinned and looked good in the store, when used for real that often fell away to reveal a clunky UI that was impossible to work with. I also found that I had to reboot every day because of lockups and crashes, plus the phone often dropped calls and was generally very slow.

I understand that this is a complete re-write of their phone OS, but I will still be waiting for a couple of years to see how others find it before I'm willing to trust that division of Microsoft again.

EDIT: I'll give you an example, our CTO recently got one of the new Windows Phones, I asked him what it was like and his response was: "Good... but I can't seem to get it connected to our Exchange server". If a rock star techie can't get his phone talking to Exchange what hope is there for the non-techies out there.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#62

Post by michaelcampbell »

code_duck wrote: post #25
ugh wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are kidding, right? One example: Have you ever actually tried to change settings or preferences in any version of Windows (for the PC)? It’s a clusterfuck and it hasn’t gotten better. The problem is not that it is ugly, the problem is that it is a pain to use. Windows 7 has done many things right and is pretty awesome in many respects but there are important areas where its usability cannot reasonably be called g…

The 'control panel' has always been a god awful nightmare... sure enough, in 95, 98, ME, 2000, XP, Vista and 7, it's disorganized and confusing, the changes they've made notwithstanding. Contrast this with Apple's System Preferences, and it's clear MS needs a basic philosophical change in how they design interfaces such as this.

You're right, and I'm playing my even-more cynical self here, but the problem with this action is that they have 2 choices - change it to be like Apple's philosophy, in which case they'll get sued by Apple for using Apple's patented "a vowel occurs in every word" technology(1) or they'll change it to be NOT like Apple's, in which case it'll be different from both Apple and MS, and no one will like it or be able to figure it out since it's neither intuitive nor familiar.

(1) There is no such patent.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#63

Post by tomkarlo »

jjguy wrote: post #57
cppsnob wrote: post #28

If I remember the numbers, leading up to the WP7 launch, MS dropped roughly 100 million on marketing. They sold less than 100,000 units on launch week. Whatever the exact numbers, I remember someone pointing out it would have been more cost effective to give the phones away for the launch. It's still that way today. They have no mindshare of the public at large, nor the developers, nor the carriers, nor the handset m…

> Microsoft has to do something that's _compellingly_ better, to someone, somewhere, on some basis that makes money. $20 says Microsoft will take over the mobile enterprise market from the now weak grasp of RIM, by focusing on security and enterprise features. Enterprises care about security. They want someone who owns the platform they can thump in the head when something goes wrong. They want complicated features t…

Is there really an "enterprise" market any more for mobile devices? Most people don't want to carry two phones. I'm not sure it's enterprises that get to decide which devices people will carry any more in most cases, especially with higher-end knowledge workers. If you look at banks and law firms, (traditionally two of the more conservative enterprise users of mobile devices) they're increasingly allowing iPhone and/or Android devices because of demand from their users.

I agree that the Android ecosystem is messy, but it also has better support for allowing "company specific" applications than the iPhone, which represent a huge advantage for large companies interesting in deploying internal directories, field sales applications, and other internal software to their mobile devices. At the same time, Apple has been improving iPhone enterprise support for years (exchange support, corporate app support, security, etc.), so it's not like they're ignoring this market, either.

If I'm a CIO choosing which devices I want to support beyond Blackberries, am I really able to say with a straight face "we're not going to support iPhones or Android, but we'll offer Windows Phone 7"??? Not if I don't work for Microsoft.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#64

Post by tomkarlo »

bbuffone wrote: post #52
cppsnob wrote: post #28

If I remember the numbers, leading up to the WP7 launch, MS dropped roughly 100 million on marketing. They sold less than 100,000 units on launch week. Whatever the exact numbers, I remember someone pointing out it would have been more cost effective to give the phones away for the launch. It's still that way today. They have no mindshare of the public at large, nor the developers, nor the carriers, nor the handset m…

This may all be true but Microsoft has something that neither Google or Apple has... that is skype. Once skype is integrated fully into Windows Phone; it will be the best communication device off all of them. Skype is the communication tool of businesses. Once skype in rolled into the basic functionality in the same way as: MSN messager, facebook and text messaging, it will be dropdead simple to make a skype call or…

Android already has solid VOIP integration via seamless Google Voice integration. It takes over all inbound and outbound calling, messaging etc.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#65

Post by nirvdrum »

petervandijck wrote: post #20
nirvdrum wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it any different than hiring from outside, where ostensibly you're trying to hire people to make the team better?

You kill the magic of a successful team if you spread them out. If a team works great together, you should keep them together. The team dynamics are a lot of that success.

I don't disagree with this. But I read your comment as moving people to another team couldn't make that new team any better. Perhaps I just misunderstood.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#66

Post by smspence »

Game_Ender wrote: post #18
ugh wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are kidding, right? One example: Have you ever actually tried to change settings or preferences in any version of Windows (for the PC)? It’s a clusterfuck and it hasn’t gotten better. The problem is not that it is ugly, the problem is that it is a pain to use. Windows 7 has done many things right and is pretty awesome in many respects but there are important areas where its usability cannot reasonably be called g…

Yep. I was installing a network printer on both XP and Windows 7 after Christmas. Those configuration dialogs have not changed in a decade, and you could scarcely call them "usable" back them.

Seriously? Installing a network printer on Windows 7 is super easy and almost completely automatic.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#67

Post by jonmrodriguez »

fjarlq wrote: post #39
jonmrodriguez wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only because Microsoft had a near-monopoly that much resembles Apple today

Apple has a near-monopoly like Microsoft? In what way? iPhone has only 15% of the worldwide smartphone market, and that share shrank slightly 3Q11 vs. 3Q10. Meanwhile Android went from 25.3% 3Q10 worldwide smartphone market to 52.5% 3Q11. In one year they doubled their share and tripled their quarterly units-shipped (20.5M to 60.5M). Source: Gartner, November 2011 http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1848514 And Mic…

You're right, I should have looked up the actual stats and I was just guessing. Should I delete my above incorrect comment or leave it there?

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#68

Post by d4nt »

d4nt wrote: post #61
freehunter wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UX must be consistently slick This point is useless, the entire number 4 in your post. First of all, if you're using it as a point, you've never used a Windows Phone. It's as stable as an iPhone (certainly moreso than Android), I've had one since April and have never had a crash, lockup, or misplaced UI element. You seem to be bringing that from Windows Mobile, which is hands down the biggest thing holding Window…

I used a Windows Mobile for a couple of years (two different handsets). I found that while the main screens were reasonably well skinned and looked good in the store, when used for real that often fell away to reveal a clunky UI that was impossible to work with. I also found that I had to reboot every day because of lockups and crashes, plus the phone often dropped calls and was generally very slow. I understand that…

The fact that I will base my purchasing decisions on past experience of the brand and word of mouth about the product is not unusual. Many people will be like me, and this is one of the challenges that MS will have to work hard to overcome. Downvoting me for being that way is pretty immature; approach the world as it is, not how you want it to be.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#69

Post by freehunter »

d4nt wrote: post #68
d4nt wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used a Windows Mobile for a couple of years (two different handsets). I found that while the main screens were reasonably well skinned and looked good in the store, when used for real that often fell away to reveal a clunky UI that was impossible to work with. I also found that I had to reboot every day because of lockups and crashes, plus the phone often dropped calls and was generally very slow. I understand that…

The fact that I will base my purchasing decisions on past experience of the brand and word of mouth about the product is not unusual. Many people will be like me, and this is one of the challenges that MS will have to work hard to overcome. Downvoting me for being that way is pretty immature; approach the world as it is, not how you want it to be.

I don't have the ability to downvote, but your reply completely missed my point. My point was, you "past experience of the brand" doesn't mean anything here, since there is no past of Windows Phone 7. It may be named number 7, but it's brand new. There was nothing like it before. The fact that you keep comparing it to Windows Mobile shows your ignorance. We as techies should have the ability to give new technology the benefit of the doubt, especially when every reviewer and user is giving it rave reviews. The only people complaining about it are those who have never used it

Your CTO either doesn't know ho to use his phone or your Exchange server is broken, and you should be able to see through that.

Re: The Critics Rave... for Microsoft?

#70

Post by freehunter »

tlb wrote: post #47

Critics have strange biases. See Scoble's review of the Palm Pre for an amusing historical example. http://scobleizer.com/2009/01/08/palm-did-what-nokia-rim-and...

Problem is, WebOS (much like WP7) was actually better than any other mobile OS at the time. It's lack of success in the market wasn't due to not having a superior OS, and it also meant the competition was free to implement all the best features before WebOS could capitalize on them.
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