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Man of the Hole

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Re: Man of the Hole

#61

Post by abarro »

cantrevealname wrote: post #59

I wonder how the government officials were able to track him for decades? The Man of the Hole moved at least 50 times during that period in an area of 31 square miles (8,000 ha), which is one-third bigger than the land area of Manhattan. We see news reports about searching for lost hikers or campers, who want to be found, involving dozens of officials, volunteers, and dogs scouring the wilderness for days or weeks wi…

I've read somewhere that it's FUNAI agents with help of other tribes living in the region.

There is some hint to that in the Wikipedia entry: "They observed that he periodically moved his home, building straw huts for shelter. He hunted wild game, collected fruits and honey, and also planted maize and manioc. Over the years, more than 50 huts built by him were identified by FUNAI."

Re: Man of the Hole

#62

Post by aflag »

cantrevealname wrote: post #59

I wonder how the government officials were able to track him for decades? The Man of the Hole moved at least 50 times during that period in an area of 31 square miles (8,000 ha), which is one-third bigger than the land area of Manhattan. We see news reports about searching for lost hikers or campers, who want to be found, involving dozens of officials, volunteers, and dogs scouring the wilderness for days or weeks wi…

The difference is that hikers die quickly and they are lost, randomly walking around. This guy was not lost, so he probably had preferred spots where he'd like to go for food, water, etc. Besides, he made large holes and possibly made other changes to his environment that made him easier to spot. Also, even if he was not spotted for months or a year, he'd be completely fine (maybe even thankful). So, time is always on the side of whoever is searching for him.

Re: Man of the Hole

#65

Post by gnramires »

friend_and_foe wrote: post #41
rajeshp1986 wrote: post #38

Breaks my hear to see the indigenous tribes and cultures dying. We will regret Deforestation & forced-modernization of these forest based tribes. In Africa & India, some of the evangelical proselytizing has destroyed very old knowledge of the land. There was one tribe in Andaman & Nicobar island which had some indigenous knowledge about weather patterns, storms and earthquakes. It was found that the members of the tr…

As much as it makes me sad to hear about it too, I think it's wishful thinking to say we will regret it. The entire history of civilization is the history of genocide and forced assimilation. Civilization is basically an ever expanding cultural grey goo meat grinder. The Romans did it to Europe and central Asia, the first caliphate did it to (ultimately) all of Arabia, the various east Asian civilizations did it to n…

I, for one, am sad about those other assimilations too.

> Civilization is basically an ever expanding cultural grey goo meat grinder

In some ways, it was, in some ways, it wasn't. Civilization allows some ideas and some ways of life that aren't/weren't possible otherwise. An example cited in this thread is that of an aboriginal group (Pintupi Nine) that became artists after contact with civilization. Surely being a dedicated artist would be much more difficult without civilization support. Many civilizations were respectful of regional differences and even local religions and other beliefs (even e.g. Alexander). I mean, modern civilization essentially respects regional differences and has understood rights w.r.t. cultures. If you look at the consensus from social sciences it seems by far in the side of non-uniformization as being healthier and preferable choice for societies (and hence for policymaking). And of course and some of the absurdities of 20th century were ideas of supremacy and forced uniformity.

And most important, civilization is not static (and not a physical law), it's a system, maybe almost like an operating system, and we continually are making choices on how to build it. And studying how our design choices contribute to better, more fulfilling, more interesting existences.

I assure you, those choices are being made right now, and more active participation, in-depth study and science are important to assure to good future. (you shouldn't use the first few OS designs as a rule that all OSes will need to follow forever)

Re: Man of the Hole

#67

Post by luckylion »

zach_garwood wrote: post #34
MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the liberty though? By definition, a native from an uncontacted tribe can't make an informed choice.

How do you figure? Every day they make the choice to live like they do, just like you make the choice to live in your town doing whatever it is you do. If you wanted to live a different lifestyle, you could pick a direction, go there, and live like the people there. They choose not to. That sounds like liberty to me.

What? Stone age people made "a choice" to live in the stone age? Could they have just chosen to live in the space age instead? How does that work?

Re: Man of the Hole

#68

Post by vardump »

I can't but think; 60 years ago this man was a baby safely with his caring mother and father. In a village, with all the other people.

He lost them all. All taken from him. His whole surrounding culture.

Imagine being him.

Re: Man of the Hole

#69

Post by Anthony-G »

friend_and_foe wrote: post #41
rajeshp1986 wrote: post #38

Breaks my hear to see the indigenous tribes and cultures dying. We will regret Deforestation & forced-modernization of these forest based tribes. In Africa & India, some of the evangelical proselytizing has destroyed very old knowledge of the land. There was one tribe in Andaman & Nicobar island which had some indigenous knowledge about weather patterns, storms and earthquakes. It was found that the members of the tr…

As much as it makes me sad to hear about it too, I think it's wishful thinking to say we will regret it. The entire history of civilization is the history of genocide and forced assimilation. Civilization is basically an ever expanding cultural grey goo meat grinder. The Romans did it to Europe and central Asia, the first caliphate did it to (ultimately) all of Arabia, the various east Asian civilizations did it to n…

Unfortunately, I think you’re right. The genocide that accompanies deforestation is barely talked about even as it’s actually ongoing. It’s not just that people don’t care; I doubt most Westerners even know how bad the situation is. These days deforestation is mostly talked about in terms of global warming and loss of biodiversity – not the extermination of ethnic groups with their own distinct language and culture. I was shocked to learn that this man had survived not one, but two genocides (first in the 70s and then the 90s) followed by further documented attempts on his life in 2009!
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