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EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

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Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#61
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

for sure. but a newly established company with strong revenues in a part of the world where there are no rules? difficult to answer.

So what? Nobody is obliged to serve any market, or a markets obliges to open for individual companies. If company A won't, companies B and C propably will.

> So what?

if your goal is more protectionism, then it’s great. but if you want to produce market leaders then it’s bad.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#62
post #22
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's good news! No more forced crappy webkit browser engine in iOS. The other things can be added in a secure fashion as well. Sideloading doesn't need to be wild west. macOS also makes it possible with certificates etc. Messanger interop is also nice, when done right: basically would need a shared standard like the web that is done by a messaging consortium like the W3.

> No more forced crappy webkit browser engine in iOS. you know this just means more chrome right? > Messanger interop is also nice, when done right: basically would need a shared standard like the web that is done by a messaging consortium like the W3. we went thru this before. didn’t work then, won’t work now.

This actually opens a race to be the best mobile browser, which might well see new entrants. As people increasingly use their mobiles as primary devices, they are more likely to move to a new browser on mobile platforms and then adapt their desktops to that choice, rather than the other way around as they did in the past. Current mobile browsers have historical baggage that a new entrant would not need to carry.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#63
post #56

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Which ones do you find ridiculous? They frankly diverge from the current status quo but to me they all go in the right direction.

i foresee a fiasco in general, but a few stand out: > Share data and metrics with developers and competitors, including marketing and advertising performance data. with competitors? :)) > Allow developers to integrate their apps and digital services directly with those belonging to a gatekeeper. This includes making messaging, voice-calling, and video-calling services interoperable with third-party services upon requ…

I don’t see why you are surprised by the sharing with competitors and the obligation of interoperability. That’s in line with what’s imposed on dominant player in an unbalanced market. Basically Europe is saying to gatekeepers that they can keep their platform but it will come with a lot of caveat from now on.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#64
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I edited my comment. I apologize - I was way off on both points.

Well not completely off, it is true that if the commission and council aren’t on board this bill will be stillborn.

Well EU law starts off life as a proposal by the Commission, so it's virtually impossible for there to be a proposal passed by Parliament and not have Commission support (unless Parliament has made significant amendments that the Commission does not like, although I'm unaware of this ever happening).

Council not agreeing is definitely a potential problem, but given the level of support from the Commission and Parliament I doubt the Council will block this.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#65

I think there are good intentions behind it, but it also misses the mark by targeting big tech specifically. The good that could have come of it, is a sort of open sourcing of tech companies... but of course none of that is going to happen. Yet we have standards; like USB-C which are a good thing. Question is who should enforce creating more standards (to address eg the interoperability of the messaging apps cited in…

Unfortunately Apple, although creating technically excellent products[0] is a very bad player as far as the environment is concerned. In particular, they insistence on thinness and related design choices (gluing everything together) makes the shelf life of their products relatively short. This is wrong no matter how you look at it. I have no problem with paying premium, I have a problem with the fact that my MacBook Pro from 2019 upgrades my main tool (Xcode) for a few hours, just because it is a 128GB model - supposedly the most popular one. I mean, it has "Pro" in the name, why does it behave like a toy? Why can't I replace the tiny 128GB drive with a 2TB one I just bought from Samsung? Because Apple decided I can't.

It wasn't always this way. Before the thinness craze, I think around 2013, you could freely replace your memory and disks - and I still have several of these machines beefed up.

[0] Most of the time - let's ignore little fucups everybody makes from time to time

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#66
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what? Nobody is obliged to serve any market, or a markets obliges to open for individual companies. If company A won't, companies B and C propably will.

> So what? if your goal is more protectionism, then it’s great. but if you want to produce market leaders then it’s bad.

If by market leader you mean creating monopolies, or oligopolies, there are rules againstt that in place. So there seems to be some concensus of seeing those outcomes as non desireable. And those rules cover consumer protection and choice, Microsoft has some experience with that when it comes to Internet Explorer.

Re: EU approves legislation to regulate Apple, Google, Meta, and other tech firms

#67
post #28
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do have the option to choose. You can buy any number of Android phones, or you can jailbreak an iPhone with custom software. Ultimately this will be bad for regular people, and good for crypto scammers, ad agencies, and companies that rely on hovering up personal data.

And now you'll be able to choose WHILE still keep using iOS which is much better for you as a consumer. This being bad for "regular people" is typical monopolistic corporate scaremongering. Apple has proven that they're more than capable of providing secure devices that provide choice with their MacBook series.

Kind of. So the primary issue is that Apple collectively bargains on behalf of customers against developers. So if you take something like privacy rights, Apple can say "hey, we've got all of these users and if you want to participate in the ecosystem you have to not track their data" - as an example.

Now what happens is that companies like Facebook and others who really want to get your data without that pesky Apple interfering is they launch legal attacks and marketing campaigns to convince people that Apple is a big bad monopoly and their "locking down" is bad for customers, etc. (so ya know, typical monopolistic corporate scaremongering) and then Apple goes and gets regulated.

With Apple finally being forced to allow a third-party app store on iOS, it makes financial sense for, well, Facebook and others to start such stores that don't respect privacy rights - Apple can't make them and then Facebook creates a neutered version of its products on Apple's App Store and creates the best version on their own (or one they support) app store. It didn't make a lot of sense to do this with just Android because you're maintaining a lot of software and it's not worth the money + you don't want to show your hand. Now with this new legislation these companies will basically eliminate a lot of customer protections that we have.

Many day-to-day people will just say "oh I need the X store for Facebook and TikTok and YouTube" and they'll sign away privacy rights to get those apps because they don't have an immediate feedback loop. They just get more and more invasive applications and then that's that.

With Apple maintaining control of the App Store ecosystem, customers could have their cake and eat it too. They got privacy rights because Apple could collectively bargain for them, but they also got their apps because so much money stands to be made anyway that companies would comply with these rules.

It absolutely blows my mind that people are rallying the pitchforks around Apple for "monopolistic corporate scaremongering" all the while missing that its all of these other "monopolistic corporate scaremongering" corporations like Facebook, Google, TikTok, Uber, and others who they're out in the streets for. I mean, you do know that Facebook is a giant corporation, right? (Not picking on Facebook here).

For me personally as a user, it means companies leave the App Store ecosystem, and devalues the iPhone and other devices.

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