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Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

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Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#61

Post by edmcnulty101 »

HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #52
edmcnulty101 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

You need to go back and re-read my comment. He is skewing by cherry-picking. The two aren’t mutually incompatible.

It's skew to you because the world is binary to you. My opinions vs The bad guys.

Joe Rogan has people with all kinds of differing opinions to create a rich marketplace of ideas where the idea wins on merit not censorship.

As I said, there's no reason to have more than one main stream person repeating the same thing repeated on every network.

When Labotomies won the Nobel Prize you would have possibly been upset that anyone would be questioning the science.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#62

Post by infinityio »

imgabe wrote: post #54
_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was a story because people, for some stupid reason, started buying the horse version of the drug and horse owners couldn't get Ivermectin for their horses anymore: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/20/ivermectin-sho... I haven't read any story that said: "It's a horsey drug for horses! If you take it, that means you're a horse!"

Yeah that didn’t really happen. The article you linked is a 404 Obviously they didn’t use those exact words, but any time it was mentioned they were sure to include something like “…which is used to treat livestock…”, when that is not really relevant since it’s also widely used for people.

To be fair, this is not entirely the case in the linked article:

> Ivermectin is a deworming agent most commonly used on horses, livestock and occasionally dogs and cats. It is used in smaller doses in humans as an anti-parasitic, to treat conditions including skin problems and headlice.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#63

Post by wozniacki »

HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #26
edmcnulty101 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

I have never said that he _only_ platforms experts that agree with him. I’m saying the skew is enormous. So (say) 99% of the relevant scientific and medical community realise ivermectin is bogus and the vaccines work. But he’ll invite on (say) a 75/25 split for/against ivermectin.

Youre trying to appear too clever. If you had not meant that you should have said as much. You were stopping just short of implying Joe Rogan invites quacks without actually using those words.

This ship for this sort of gaslighting has long sailed. Please do not do this. People have had enough of this disinfo-in-all-but-name only for the past two years. You will seem duplicitous if you do this sort of stuff.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#65

Post by eggy »

HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #12
simonh wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair to Joe he wasn't giving medical advice, but licensed doctors on his show were.

This sounds reasonable, until you realise that his opinions massively skew which licensed doctors he lets on the show. So effectively you’re ending up with him pushing his opinion anyway. If you cherry-pick your experts enough, you’ll be able to find one that agrees with you, no matter how absurd your position. I’ll also note that much of the time the licensed doctors he invites on aren’t actually in relevant special…

So tired of people attacking Joe Rogan. He's a pod caster. How come people don't push more on the 'experts' like Wolensky or Fauci or the main stream media? Ignoring natural immunity, not releasing publicly funded data to scientists and citizens to do science, openly lying in the name of 'for your own good', or tweeting a statistic that is way off from the data they released - the list goes on, and these are the highly-paid experts who have pushed for science as a belief rather than a method or system for examining phenomenon. How many people have they harmed (children being masked while old farts in government hug and talk face-to-face; pushing vaccines on 5-11 year-olds with a 12% efficacy after only 30 days, on and on). I think people just like to dog pile on people like Rogan; they should be turning some of that scrutiny upon the people they listen to or extol as experts. CNN calling Ivermectin "horse dewormer" or "horse medicine" was blatant propaganda, and not journalism, yet people rely on CNN for their information, too much I fear.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#66

Post by FeepingCreature »

edmcnulty101 wrote: post #22
jiggawatts wrote: post #6

Ivermectin works because the first trials were done in developing economies where the average person had a high chance of parasitic infections. The steroids used as a standard front-line treatment for severe COVID decreases the immune response to parasites, allowing them to multiply unchecked. This killed patients indirectly, but dead is dead , and they "checked in" with COVID, not parasite complaints. Ivermectin is…

What you're saying is a theory. It's a good theory but youre technically spouting misinformation by claiming it's hard fact. This theory was developed by Scott Alexander from SSC in his ivermectin blog post. Joe Rogan never claimed anyone should take medical advice from him. He had Sanjay Gupta and Robert Malone both medical doctors with differing opinions. This is how the media is supposed to work. It's not supposed…

Far as I know, the theory was proposed first by @GidMK on Twitter. (For the record.)

edit: Apparently someone else? I've seen it on Twitter before Scott's blog, but I can't find the thread anymore.

edit: It was Avi Bitterman @AviBittMD. Also linked in the article.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#67

Post by headsoup »

coldtea wrote: post #16
HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds reasonable, until you realise that his opinions massively skew which licensed doctors he lets on the show. So effectively you’re ending up with him pushing his opinion anyway. If you cherry-pick your experts enough, you’ll be able to find one that agrees with you, no matter how absurd your position. I’ll also note that much of the time the licensed doctors he invites on aren’t actually in relevant special…

> If you cherry-pick your experts enough, you’ll be able to find one that agrees with you, no matter how absurd your position. So? Some experts are more experts than others?

Interesting you are downvoted, this is precisely what is happening. The contradicting experts are quickly labelled as quacks and loonies, yet we have a long history of the early critical voices being eventually proved right (cholesterol, sugar, cigarettes, asbestos, Oxycodone, bio-labs, roundup, DDT, radium, etc). It's a long list and yet we behave the same every single time.

This time I'm sure the consensus/"the science" has got it right though.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#68

Post by nojito »

jiggawatts wrote: post #6

Ivermectin works because the first trials were done in developing economies where the average person had a high chance of parasitic infections. The steroids used as a standard front-line treatment for severe COVID decreases the immune response to parasites, allowing them to multiply unchecked. This killed patients indirectly, but dead is dead , and they "checked in" with COVID, not parasite complaints. Ivermectin is…

This entire comment is wrong and yet it is currently the top comment.

What is it about COVID that causes people to just forget to think critically about what they read?

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#69

Post by aczerepinski »

edmcnulty101 wrote: post #22
jiggawatts wrote: post #6

Ivermectin works because the first trials were done in developing economies where the average person had a high chance of parasitic infections. The steroids used as a standard front-line treatment for severe COVID decreases the immune response to parasites, allowing them to multiply unchecked. This killed patients indirectly, but dead is dead , and they "checked in" with COVID, not parasite complaints. Ivermectin is…

What you're saying is a theory. It's a good theory but youre technically spouting misinformation by claiming it's hard fact. This theory was developed by Scott Alexander from SSC in his ivermectin blog post. Joe Rogan never claimed anyone should take medical advice from him. He had Sanjay Gupta and Robert Malone both medical doctors with differing opinions. This is how the media is supposed to work. It's not supposed…

Not every issue needs to have both sides represented as if they are both reasonable and should both be considered. For example if you have a NASA expert talking about nearby galaxies, it isn't necessary to also invite a flat-earther to spout whatever nonsense they believe about space.

During a deadly pandemic that's killing millions, it's perfectly fine to only present the information that will save lives.

Re: Ivermectin Didn’t Reduce Covid-19 Hospitalizations in Largest Trial to Date

#70

Post by PaulHoule »

imgabe wrote: post #36

The whole Ivermectin debacle was ridiculous. I never had Covid. Or if I did, it was so mild I never noticed. So, I really have no dog in this fight. But the way the media handled this coverage was really, really off-putting. First, if it doesn't work, just say that. "It doesn't work". "Ivermectin is not an effective treatment for Covid". That's all that was really necessary, right? But no, there was this whole ridicu…

Ivermectin is used in human medicine too, but not much in the u.s.

One time we had 4 humans and several cats in the house and we could see the worms in the litter box and could see them in the human feces too so we gave everybody (humans and cats) pyrantel which is what gets used for that here.

People get ivermectin in Africa where the problem is worse, but it is going to be in an appropriate dosage and form.

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